Newbie questions...

[DAGtunes]

Hello all,

Just found this forum, whilst searching the `net for towing solutions for my 2005 Jeep Liberty Renegade. I read a good post by "Dave" (my name too, actually) about general towing info. Though I'm sure these have been asked before, I've got a couple of questions:

1: What make/model ****** cooler is the biggest/best that will fit into my vehicle. I've got the factory tow package, and standard ****** cooler, but have managed to trigger the "Trans Temp" console light a few times while towing our Popup tent trailer and doing light off-road.

2: At what temperature does the "Trans Temp" light come on? Is it before there is any real danger? I'm considering having a trans temperature gauge installed...

3: For those that do tow, what do you do with your rear-center mounted spare tire? I have to remove mine to tow. Not only will it interfere with the coupler of my trailer, but it hits the toungue jack handle, as well.

4: Has anyone done an aftermarket lift to their Liberty, and did it affect the towing capacity? In what way?

In general, my Liberty has served quite well as a tow vehicle. I live in California, and have towed my 3500 lb Popup into the Sierras a few times...I've also triggered the "dummy" light a few times though. I recently had the ****** flushed and re-filled with all-synthetic ****** fluid, after a particularly bad trip. (Sequoia Nat'l Forest)

I just returned from a camping trip up at Shaver Lake, CA. I made the climb from the central valley up to about 5000' elevation just fine, but about 4 miles from the campground, the "Trans Temp" light came on. I pulled over and put it in Nuetral to cool down (as it says to do in the manual), and actually got a little smoke coming off the ******/exhaust. (Not Good) It performed well for the rest of the trip, and the ****** fluid looks OK (Pink), so I'm not sure what exactly was smoking...

Either way, I think I need a bigger/better ****** cooler and a gauge so I know exactly what temp the ****** fluid is at - before it overheats!

Thanks for any input you may have!

 

[tjkj2002]

First welcome........

1)I run a Hayden ****** cooler on my 45RFE '02 ******,the one rated for a 28,000lbs GVWR RV,I don't have the HD cooling.Got it at Advance Auto Parts for like $40.The '05's have the weaker 42RLE ******(minivan ******).

2)Not sure,never had mine come on though.

3)I towed my 6x10 enclosed trailer(no longer have) with my spare on the rear gate,also have towed a few U-Haul trailers with my spare on with no problems.I also have 265/75R16 tires,much bigger then the stockers.

4)Sure have,I'm running the "pre-soft ride" SkyJacker 2 1/2" coil lift(got 3 3/4" of lift),The FrankinLift or OME lift is the most popular.I have towed over 5000lbs before with my lift,no problems.I also removed my rear swaybar with no ill effects on road or when towing.

 

[desertkj]

Welcome to the forum. I have very limited experience with towing, but the few times I have I just removed the spare tire and carried it in the Jeep. Mine cleared barely but I was concerned about the jack handle hitting the tire and tweaking something while in motion.

 

[DAGtunes]

Thanks for your responses thus far.

My Liberty is stock, so no lift yet. My trailer, however, is a Starcraft 11RT off-road model. It's got better clearance than my tow vehicle! In order to keep it towing level, I had to raise the ball up a bit, to where it is resting just under the spare. (We're talking 1/4" between ball and spare here...)

Here's a picture:

You must be registered for see images attach

The picture is slightly deceiving because of the angle, and the Jeep being in a slight depression in the road. On flat ground the whole rig is level.

I can't put the spare in the Jeep, as there are three of us (me, wife, kid) and a Golden Retriever in there - plus some cargo. I usually put it in the roof rack, or on the deck of the trailer. However, I'm looking to change that, too...

 

[LibertyOrDeath]

Just a question? When your dummy light comes on is your OD turned off. Overdrive should be off for towing. If you plan on towing make sure you get the Old Man Emu HD springs.

 

[Dave]

Keep O/D off for towing. That might solve your problem.

As to the hitch, did you try a 14" drawbar. I have one and it is just a straight bar. It brings the ball out to just past the spare. One of my trailers requires it to clear the tire and attach. The longer drawbars can reduce tongue weight capacity, but your trailer is the smaller type and I don't think it will matter.

By the way, nice trailer.

Dave

 

[KeswickDave]

Welcome and nice trailer!

To add to what others have said, O/D off when towing, and based on my experience, try to minimize shifting.

I towed around 3500 lbs, about 3400 miles last summer. Within the first 50 miles I had the trans temp light on. Needless to say that freaked me out a bit.

After that I really concentrated more on avoiding shifting where possible, using the cruise control and letting the speed drop when going uphill instead of downshifting and trying to maintain it, until there wasn't any other option.

After that I never saw that light again and the engine temp was very stable as well.

With regard to the spare, you can try flipping the mount over 180 degrees, that moves the spare tire up and in at the bottom a bit, but by the sounds of your setup that might not help much... a longer drawbar might be another option.

Good luck!

Another Dave

 

[JeepJeepster]

As others have said, make sure to always use the O/D off when towing. If its needed, drop the ****** into 2nd if it starts shifts to and from 3rd to 2nd, etc. Do the same thing with 1st if you are going that slow.

Offroad, make sure to use 4low when its needed and limit the ****** to the proper gear.

Ive offroaded ALOT in the heat of summer(90F+) and Ive towed around 2500lbs in the hills of eastern ky. Ive never had the ****** temp light come on at all. I know a few others that tow and offroad ALOT more than I do in elevations ALOT higher than Ive ever been in with the 42rle and theyve never had any troubles.

We have a Jayco pop-up and its around 3300-3400lbs loaded with A/C, Heat and 20+ gallons of water.

You must be registered for see images attach

1. See tjkjs post.

2. idk.

3. I have the Draw-tite hitch which has an extended neck, its not a problem with mine. You can get longer receivers.

4. If you get the proper suspension it will tow better. The OME HD suspension being one of them. I have air bags with OME HD springs so I dont even know what sagging is.

 

[DAGtunes]

Thanks, all.

Yeah, I already learned the "O/D Lockout" thing. (The hard way, of course!) I've also been schooled in making better use of the gears. I was taught that the peak horsepower for the Liberty would be to keep the RPM's up around 4k, and so I shift accordingly, as needed.

The Liberty is the first "automatic" I've ever owned, so a lot of this (O/D, etc.) was definitely new to me, as it just happened naturally with a manual transmission.

Regarding "hitch extenders," I had read that they decrease your towing capacity by up to 50%? In addition, they add a bit of "slop" to your connections, and possibly contribute to trailer sway? That's what has kept me away from those. My factory tow package is rated at 5000 lbs, and the GVWR of my trailer is 3500 lbs. I probably tow it at close to that weight too, with all the tanks full, and cargo on the deck.

Regarding suspension, no problems with "sag" thus far with the stock suspension. But I'm thinking of modding the Liberty a bit...making it a bit more "off-road capable." (Lift, etc.) I just want to be sure that by doing so, I'm not gonna decrease it's capacity to tow.

Does anyone have any technical docs that might reveal at what temperature the "dummy light" comes on for Trans temp?

Also, I've seen mention elsewhere on this forum of some sort of software/firmware change for the on board computer? What does that do?

Thanks for all your help!

 

[Atrus]

I could be wrong here....

Keep in mind the towing capacity of the KJ is due to frame/drivetrain/suspension limitations. The hitch receiver is most likely rated MUCH higher than what the KJ is capable of towing.

So, even if a longer draw bar does decrease capacity due to leverage, the extra strain is being put on the draw bar. I don't think the KJ would really see any difference. At the weight that we can pull, I don't think it's an issue. Get up to towing 7,500 or 10,000 lbs and you may have issues.

Also, people are saying a longer draw bar - NOT a htich extender. A longer draw bar is still a solid bar, and it's all 1 piece. Much stronger than an extender in which you'll have two pins.joints - one between standard drawbar and extender, and one beween extender/receiver.

Someone tell me if I am wrong in my logic.

 

[DAGtunes]

...Also, people are saying a longer draw bar - NOT a htich extender. A longer draw bar is still a solid bar, and it's all 1 piece. Much stronger than an extender in which you'll have two pins.joints - one between standard drawbar and extender, and one beween extender/receiver.

Someone tell me if I am wrong in my logic.

Cool. I get you. Good point. But I don't really want to switch out the hitch. The factory hitch is solid, and works fine, I've just found the spare issue to be a pain for my setup. I'm looking into a few other solutions, and actually tjkj's offset swing-spare rear-bumper mount could solve the problem by itself...I'll have to consider that.

Another option I'm considering is permanently relocating it to a roof rack.

 

[JeepJeepster]

Were not talking about getting another hitch, were talking about just getting a longer ball mount- Thats the part with the ball on it.

 

[jsc7002]

i call it the ball mount

 

[Atrus]

Were not talking about getting another hitch, were talking about just getting a longer receiver. Thats the part with the ball on it.

The way I see it:

Receiver - The big thing mounted on the Jeep that "receives" the Draw Bar
Draw Bar - The solid metal bar that the hitch ball bolts though and that the pin goes through to mount to the receiver
Hitch Ball - the ball that the tongue of the trailer clamps to.

Just like Blake is saying - buy a longer Draw Bar, NOT a Draw Bar extension. It'll run you $30 or so max.

 

[JeepJeepster]

The way I see it:

Receiver - The big thing mounted on the Jeep that "receives" the Draw Bar
Draw Bar - The solid metal bar that the hitch ball bolts though and that the pin goes through to mount to the receiver
Hitch Ball - the ball that the tongue of the trailer clamps to.

Just like Blake is saying - buy a longer Draw Bar, NOT a Draw Bar extension. It'll run you $30 or so max.

Got it.

Fixed it to keep down confusion. Ive always called it a 'receiver' since it receives the trailer but I hadn't really thought about it.

 

[DAGtunes]

Oops. I see. I got hung up on terminology too.

I've actually purchased the longest "drawbar" I could find. (Called a "ball mount" in the circles I travel) It did reach out just slightly beyond my spare, but still not enough. The edge of the coupler rubbed against the sidewall. I wasn't comfortable with that...

The real issue is the height I had to bring the ball up to to get the trailer level. If you notice in my pic, the trailer is quite a bit higher than my stock Liberty. I bought a 3 1/2" drop ball mount (drawbar), and flipped it upside down, to rise up 1 1/2", plus the 3" (or so) height of the ball.

If I ever lift my Liberty (or should I say when...) I'll be buying my 3rd ball mount! I'll probably still have to remove the spare, though, due to the (non-removable) tongue-jack handle potentially hitting on sharp turns.

 

[KeswickDave]

When I got my Mopar hitch installed (dealer), I remember them saying something like "we need to order in a special draw bar for the Liberty, to clear the spare tire". I recall it did clear it, but I don't use that bar anymore, and so I don't recall by how much exactly. It was pretty long though.

It may also depend on the exact brand of hitch (reciever) you have, as I've heard some of them extend further than others.

If anyone's interested I could pop it on, take a few pics / measurements this weekend.

Dave

 

[DAGtunes]

KeswickDave,

That would be great if you could! Actually the make and model would be good too...

I've already gotten the longest "drawbar/ball-mount" that I could find with a 2" rise. (Mistakenly said 1.5" rise above...it's actually 2"!) It is 11" long from the pin-hole to the ball.

A longer one might do the trick. (OK, OK, keep those comments to yourselves...)

Thanks!

 

[KeswickDave]

Shoot, just saw your reply now... I've had a busy weekend, and currently have my travel trailer hooked up to the Jeep, ready to go to the dealer to get the A/C fixed (warranty repair left over from last summer).

I can't install the bar to take a pic, but I could take a pic of the bar... give me a few minutes, I'll see if I can find it! I'll try tomorrow night to pop it on the Jeep for ya. I'll check for make and model, not sure if it says so - got it through the dealer.

Dave

 

[KeswickDave]

OK here it is... looks like 12" from pin hole to ball hole.

Not sure exactly how you measure the rise/drop?

You must be registered for see images

Here's what I have on at the moment:

You must be registered for see images

No problem clearing the tire with that puppy

I will probably take this one off tomorrow so I will try real hard to remember to pop the other one in and take a picture for ya!

Dave