Toyo Open Country vs Yoko Geolander A/T-S

[Atrus]

Screw all of them! I didn't buy "Trail Ready" so I could hear the high notes on the opera cd while crusin the mall. I'd a bought a Hummer if I wanted quiet and wimpy. General Grabber AT2 or equivlent at a minimum. If Firestone Destinations is what mak(blarg)es ya happy buy a new mini van.

Trail Ready is a joke, just like Hemi. It's a marketing scheme. I yanked trail rated off my jeep within the first 1,000 miles.

If I lived in the country and needed it, I'd throw MT-R's on. I live in suburbia, drive 55 miles round trip a day (to the city) and offroad less than half a dozen times a year. Snow, I am in snow often. Why buy something crazy aggressive when I don't use it? That's poser in my book.

 

[HoosierJeeper]

Did someone call the 5.7 Hemi a joke????

 

[Redbone]

Trail Ready is a joke, just like Hemi. It's a marketing scheme. I yanked trail rated off my jeep within the first 1,000 miles.

If I lived in the country and needed it, I'd throw MT-R's on. I live in suburbia, drive 55 miles round trip a day (to the city) and offroad less than half a dozen times a year. Snow, I am in snow often. Why buy something crazy aggressive when I don't use it? That's poser in my book.

I'm sorry if I offended u in some way. I'm not sure where u got that quote from. It looks very argumentative to me.
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[jnaut]

Trail Ready is a joke, just like Hemi. It's a marketing scheme. I yanked trail rated off my jeep within the first 1,000 miles.

If I lived in the country and needed it, I'd throw MT-R's on. I live in suburbia, drive 55 miles round trip a day (to the city) and offroad less than half a dozen times a year. Snow, I am in snow often. Why buy something crazy aggressive when I don't use it? That's poser in my book.

Trail Rated meant that the vehicle was able to perform off-road to a certain specification.

Definition: Trail Rated signifies that the vehicles have passed off road testing by the Nevada Automotive Test Center (NATC) -- which evaluates vehicles for traction, ground clearance, off road articulation, maneuverability, and water fording.

There has been some discussion as to whether or not Jeep has stretched this definition. According to AllPar, there is a 'Trail Rated' version of the Patriot, and a non-trail rated version. To wit: http://www.allpar.com/model/jeep/patriot.html

See also: http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-109386635.html

Jeep adds less-rugged models; 2004 4x4s will be badged `Trail Rated'; new-style SUVs won't.

 

[jnaut]

I fully understand the "A/T's do nothing well" philosophy. For me, they work.

There's two ways to look at this philosophy. You could argue they do nothing well, or you could argue that they do nothing horribly. For instance, Street tires do very poorly off-road. Full M/T's do very poorly on road. The A/T will do both fairly well. The A/T is the best tire for people who use their Jeep as a daily driver, and spend the lionshare of time on the road. Especially for those of us that live in very rainy climates with extremely steep hills. It doesn't make any sense for me to spend all my time running around on slick pavement with cleats on.

For me, A/T's are a glass-half-full scenario. If you live in a super dry climate, or in a rural environement with lots of dirt and it's not your daily driver? Then sure, get the M/T. But for those of us who spend most of our time here:

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but get into sh*t every few weekends, the A/T is the best choice.

 

[Redbone]

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Caravelle

 

[Atrus]

So if u believe that crap u wrote why u got all that poser crap wrote in ur sig? screwy.gifheadscratch.gif











:^o owned

Not quite, sweetheart but you can try again. I bought the KJ and threw the AT2's on it at 10k miles. I intended on going offroading more often then I do. Life got in the way. MBA, CPA, 50+ hours a week with 10+ hours of commuting a week. My wheelin' buddy just had a kid, so he's going to be tied up. In retrospect would I have bought what I did? Nah, probably not. That's why hindsight is 20/20.

Besides, what do I have that's so extreme? A CB...a $20 front spacer....$50 in rear spacers. Oh, and tires.

For me, A/T's are a glass-half-full scenario. If you live in a super dry climate, or in a rural environement with lots of dirt and it's not your daily driver? Then sure, get the M/T. But for those of us who spend most of our time here:

Totally agree. I don't sit gridlocked like that, and that's really the problem. These things are loud between 70 and 80, which is the speed I travel at mostly. Glad someone feels that same way I do about A/T's. Street tires = overkill for me, M/T's = overkill.

Trail Rated meant that the vehicle was able to perform off-road to a certain specification.

Ed Zachary. It's turned into a gimmick. There's nothing special about them, 4x4 = badge.

 

[Atrus]

Did someone call the 5.7 Hemi a joke????

The engine's just fine but the whole "My schwanson is bigger than your schwanson because I have Hemi on the side!" is BS. It's an engine. It's a decent engine. It's comparable to Ford and GM's offerings, but it says Hemi.

 

[HoosierJeeper]

I know not to brag about it to 6.2 L GM owner....but anything else it's fair game I think....

 

[Atrus]

Again, I am not saying the engine *****. I am just saying it's perfectly on par with it's competitors. So, marketing calls it a Hemi again and everyone goes nuts and thinks they can drag their truck or something. It's no better or worse than the competition, it just has a badge.

 

[J-Thompson]

There's two ways to look at this philosophy. You could argue they do nothing well, or you could argue that they do nothing horribly. For instance, Street tires do very poorly off-road. Full M/T's do very poorly on road. The A/T will do both fairly well. The A/T is the best tire for people who use their Jeep as a daily driver, and spend the lionshare of time on the road. Especially for those of us that live in very rainy climates with extremely steep hills. It doesn't make any sense for me to spend all my time running around on slick pavement with cleats on.

For me, A/T's are a glass-half-full scenario. If you live in a super dry climate, or in a rural environement with lots of dirt and it's not your daily driver? Then sure, get the M/T. But for those of us who spend most of our time here:

You must be registered for see images

but get into sh*t every few weekends, the A/T is the best choice.

good point
but also point less
here is what we are doing to make it so we dont have to deal with that situation
we have a TJ ,built up and it ***** for a DD
we have a KJ ,nothing special but is fine for a DD which now ***** off road due to the AT's it has on it
problem with the TJ is that if we want to go on an easy to moderate trail ride as a family ,me my wife and a 2 year old, it is way to small
the KJ can handle these trails ,with some mods including good MT's
so the plan as of now is to get the MT's and a locker for the KJ
but retire it from full DD duty
then get a true commuter ,like a VW Jetta TDI at 45 mpg it will be getting TWICE the milage out of 1 gallon of fuel when compared to the KJ

want a DD then get a DD
want to own a Jeep then own a Jeep
but you can not have your cake and eat it too

 

[boebr1]

The engine's just fine but the whole "My schwanson is bigger than your schwanson because I have Hemi on the side!" is BS. It's an engine. It's a decent engine. It's comparable to Ford and GM's offerings, but it says Hemi.

i believe my geo metro had a hemi in it... maybe that was only the 3cyl version that was a hemi.... hemi refers to hemispherical head design (plugs wind up in the middle of the head, not to the side)

 

[Redbone]

Not quite, sweetheart but you can try again. I bought the KJ and threw the AT2's on it at 10k miles. I intended on going offroading more often then I do. Life got in the way. MBA, CPA, 50+ hours a week with 10+ hours of commuting a week. My wheelin' buddy just had a kid, so he's going to be tied up. In retrospect would I have bought what I did? Nah, probably not. That's why hindsight is 20/20.

Besides, what do I have that's so extreme? A CB...a $20 front spacer....$50 in rear spacers. Oh, and tires.

Sounds like u have had a very busy life. I hope u can find time to enjoy the KJs 4x4 features now.
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Weed Vaporizers

 

[Mahkis]

Hmmmm......back to the tires subject. I just got a set of Hankook ATM RF10's on my KJ a few weeks back and so far they are a good tire. Just as quiet if not quieter than the stock GY HP's and are better in dry and wet conditions. After today snow doesn't seem outta the question here in MI and can't wait to take them out in it. I've had all kinds of tires on all kinds of trucks and suv's from BFG AT's to Swamper's to ProComps to Kumho's etc. Right now an AT is the tire for me. Check out http://www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/wheels/129_0811_hankook_bfgoodrich_toyo_tire_test/index.html Tested up against the Toyo and BFG AT. I know they are not American made but I couldn't pass up the price I got them for.

 

[Redbone]

Again, I am not saying the engine *****. I am just saying it's perfectly on par with it's competitors. So, marketing calls it a Hemi again and everyone goes nuts and thinks they can drag their truck or something. It's no better or worse than the competition, it just has a badge.

"it just has a badge" .... truer words were never spoken.
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Marijuana Vaporizer

 

[Atrus]

Hmmmm......back to the tires subject. I just got a set of Hankook ATM RF10's on my KJ a few weeks back and so far they are a good tire. Just as quiet if not quieter than the stock GY HP's and are better in dry and wet conditions. After today snow doesn't seem outta the question here in MI and can't wait to take them out in it. I've had all kinds of tires on all kinds of trucks and suv's from BFG AT's to Swamper's to ProComps to Kumho's etc. Right now an AT is the tire for me. Check out http://www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/wheels/129_0811_hankook_bfgoodrich_toyo_tire_test/index.html Tested up against the Toyo and BFG AT. I know they are not American made but I couldn't pass up the price I got them for.

Interesting - they have a nice looking tread pattern. I'll have to check into those. Thanks for mentioning them.

 

[J-Thompson]

This may be true if you live in the conditions in that picture. Luckily for some of us life can be different. I could use a radical rock crawler with open headers for a DD. Also I can use the Trail Rated abilities on my very own property (and sometimes do). All I needed was a nice set of Grabbers for me and the grandkids to have a ball. Then I drop the kiddies off, take her out of 4wd, & I'm off to work, gro. store, Dr., etc. Yessir, I gots my cake & eat it too. Life is good.

I can tell that you have never eaten some real off road cake
because trust me a KJ with grabbers is not even a sprinkle in the cake
that I like

 

[Redbone]

Back to tyres. Which priority is the highest,quietness or off road traction?
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[ThunderbirdJunkie]

want a DD then get a DD
want to own a Jeep then own a Jeep
but you can not have your cake and eat it too

x2
If ThunderbirdJunkie wanted to run ATs, he would have bought an Escape. But then, AT's would have been useless, therefore he would have bought a street tire.

 

[Atrus]

Sigh - I love how people can completely skew the convo.

NO, I DO NOT MIND SOME NOISE! Grabbers made noise since Day 1. I didn't mind. This isn't my first set of A/T's - I had 31x10.5 TKO's on my Bronco. THESE ARE NOT BEHAVING NORMALLY AND ARE LOUDER THAN NORMAL. If I wanted luxury I woulda bought a Lexus. My KJ pops and groans and rattles and I don't care. It's been a good vehicle for the 40k that I have had it. It's done perfectly fine with the fairly light offroading I've done (yeah, I'll readily admit I don't to TJKJ crazy stuff. The offroading I do is a walk in the park to someone like him). Oh, surprisingly it did just as well offroad without the badge! Shocker, I removed the 3.7L and 4x4 badge too! I like every aspect of the Grabbers except for the crazy noise they have developed. Do they ride rougher than stock? Sure. Are they noiser than stock? sure. What I am talking about is above and beyond normal.


Here:
1) Trail Rated means nothing, it's every Jeep 4x4. Rubicon? That means something.
2) Hemi is a marketing gimmick. There are other Hemi manufacturers out there. They don't put it on their vehicles. Here, 3 second search. I don't normally consider wikipedia a really strong reference, but they hit the nail on the head.

"Many of today's engines use active combustion chambers designed to tumble and swirl the fuel/air mix within the chamber for the most efficient combustion event possible. These active chambers usually look like kidney beans or two merged small 'hemi' areas surrounded by flat quenching areas over the pistons. By the end of the 1970s, development of engines utilizing true hemispherical chambers had ceased around the world; it had been gradually displaced by dramatically improved newer engine designs. Today, "hemi" is more of a trademark than a description of a combustion chamber."

Don't you think if it was the magic design all mfg's would use it? It, like all other designs, has it's limitations and detriments. The fact is, though, that 99% of the population sees that badge and has no clue what it means and thinks that their truck can do a wheelie or some stupid crap. It's a whole lot of marketing dollars. Kudos to Chrysler for doing it and it working, I am just not going to be the sheep that follows it.


Sorry, my little bean counter brain just can't seem to accept that Hemi = decimate all.