Liberty vs. Wrangler

[LaneKJ]

So I read on another Jeep Owners forum that, "The Liberty can not be compared to a Wrangler." ... What do you guys think?

 

[ridenby]

Two different vehicles for sure. They both come factory with junky balljoints.

 

[dude1116]

Two different vehicles for sure. They both come factory with junky balljoints.

Well the solid front axle is certainly an advantage over IFS. I still wouldn't count the KJ out of the competition though...

I find it much more maneuverable. It's the perfect size, and handles are turns on the trail with ease.

I also have never driven a Wrangler. I feel like people who dis the Liberty for the Wrangler are basically just over compensating for the off roading that they DON'T do.

 

[eyehatetofu]

No comparison. I have seen mildly built Wranglers do things that were insane. Stuff I couldn't even begin to attempt in my KJ, and I have attempted some pretty stupid things.

I do think a lifted Libby can hold its own against a stock Wrangler though. But a Wrangler with the same amount of lift can fit 35" tires and then there is once again no comparison.

Wrangler's aren't very family friendly, make horrible DD's, loud as hell, very short on space, drive like dump-trucks, and are even less fuel efficient than a KJ though. Depends on what you want the vehicle for. You want something that is built to off-road, get a TJ. You want something that meets many people's all around needs, get a KJ or a Grand / Cherokee.

Well the solid front axle is certainly an advantage over IFS. I still wouldn't count the KJ out of the competition though...

I find it much more maneuverable. It's the perfect size, and handles are turns on the trail with ease.

I also have never driven a Wrangler. I feel like people who dis the Liberty for the Wrangler are basically just over compensating for the off roading that they DON'T do.

Way more people with Wrangler's wheel their vehicles than Liberty owners do. I have met very few KJ wheelers. Met hundreds and hundreds of CJ, YJ, TJ, and JK wheelers. Also, a TJ will out maneuver a KJ any day. The shorter wheelbase is pretty advantageous there.

 

[tjkj2002]

. Also, a TJ will out maneuver a KJ any day. The shorter wheelbase is pretty advantageous there.

Actually that is not true,it hurts them more then anything and why most stretch there wheel bases to or a little longer then a KJ.

 

[dude1116]

Actually that is not true,it hurts them more then anything and why most stretch there wheel bases to or a little longer then a KJ.

Also explains why people like the Unlimiteds for wheeling much more. I found that the KJ has a near perfect stance for everything I've done.

 

[dude1116]

Way more people with Wrangler's wheel their vehicles than Liberty owners do. I have met very few KJ wheelers. Met hundreds and hundreds of CJ, YJ, TJ, and JK wheelers. Also, a TJ will out maneuver a KJ any day. The shorter wheelbase is pretty advantageous there.

Hey now! I never said I've met more KJ wheelers! I'm saying there's way too many people that don't do what the Wrangler is made to do

 

[BjBnet]

I wouldn't mind a Wrangler but it seems there are too many around here. Most of them have mods to them so it would be hard for me to compete and have a unique vehicle. There are WAYYYY too many accessories for the Wrangler that any Joe can use to dress up their ride.
I like the attention I get with my KJ.
Plus the towing capacity is greater.

 

[eyehatetofu]

Actually that is not true,it hurts them more then anything and why most stretch there wheel bases to or a little longer then a KJ.

Gotta disagree on that. There is a reason why the wheelbase hasn't changed much in the past 40 whatever years of CJ's, YJ's, and TJ's. And maneuverability is a big factor of that. Ask any 4 door JK owner (aka school bus driver). Guys aren't stretching their rigs to maneuver better. It is due to stability more than anything. Gotta go longer if you plan to go bigger. And a stretched Wrangler is so far removed from a KJ that there is absolutely no discussion on the merits of one vs. the other.

Also explains why people like the Unlimiteds for wheeling much more. I found that the KJ has a near perfect stance for everything I've done.

Unlimiteds have a lot more room as well. Many find that a necessity that a SWB Wrangler doesn't have. I think that may have a lot to do with it. The LJ's ass end hangs out way more than a TJ, and the new JKU's are boats out on the trails in stock form.

And not to be a dik, but what you do in a KJ, pales in comparison to what can be done in a budget boosted Wrangler on 33's. I really dig my Libby, but am realistic with its limitations. I know there are better vehicles off-road. I don't see the need to constantly compare a KJ to Wrangler. Different vehicles.

Hey now! I never said I've met more KJ wheelers! I'm saying there's way too many people that don't do what the Wrangler is made to do

I would bet you somewhere around 95% of Liberty's have never seen a trail. I bet that number is way less for Wranglers.

Don't take this as KJ hate. Just this comes up a lot, and isn't an apples to apples comparison. It is like an apples to zucchini comparison.

 

[dude1116]

And not to be a dik, but what you do in a KJ, pales in comparison to what can be done in a budget boosted Wrangler on 33's. I really dig my Libby, but am realistic with its limitations. I know there are better vehicles off-road. I don't see the need to constantly compare a KJ to Wrangler. Different vehicles.



I would bet you somewhere around 95% of Liberty's have never seen a trail. I bet that number is way less for Wranglers.

Don't take this as KJ hate. Just this comes up a lot, and isn't an apples to apples comparison. It is like an apples to zucchini comparison.

You're really just missing all of my points -___-

I know a Wrangler is much better. I know hardly and KJs wheel. I know Wrangler owners wheel more often. And I know the two don't compare...

Sheesh I would have bought a TJ if I could afford it. I couldn't, so I bought the KJ. And I'm VERY happy and EXTREMELY impressed with it.

 

[tjkj2002]

Gotta disagree on that. There is a reason why the wheelbase hasn't changed much in the past 40 whatever years of CJ's, YJ's, and TJ's. And maneuverability is a big factor of that. Ask any 4 door JK owner (aka school bus driver). Guys aren't stretching their rigs to maneuver better. It is due to stability more than anything. Gotta go longer if you plan to go bigger. And a stretched Wrangler is so far removed from a KJ that there is absolutely no discussion on the merits of one vs. the other.




.

Try some trails out here,a stretched TJ makes doing shelfs/steps easier due to the longer wheelbase.Plus many like to do doublers and add D60's/14b's and gotta have a driveshaft longer then 6".Ever see a stock rear TJ driveshaft? It's about half the length of the KJ's.

 

[retmil46]

Well, my KJ has something that the serious Wrangler offroaders can only wish they had - a diesel with as much low end torque as a V8. When they find out what's under the hood, there's no mention of "chick ride" or "mall cruiser" - just a look of envy in their eyes and they start carping about how they wished Chrysler would have put that powertrain in a Wrangler or Wrangler Unlimited in the U.S., and what they could do offroad with that engine.

Matter of fact, there's a gent in San Antonio that makes a good living dropping Toyota diesels into other vehicles - and one of his main items is dropping this same drivetrain into Wrangler Unlimiteds. Ain't cheap though - it looks like factory when he's done, and it costs accordingly.

 

[Jo6pak]

Apples and Oranges.

I don't compare them. I like them both, but for me the KJ fills my needs better

 

[Dave]

So I read on another Jeep Owners forum that, "The Liberty can not be compared to a Wrangler." ... What do you guys think?

They should be saying...."the Liberty can not be compared to a Wrangler in off-road capability." (comparing both stock) The wrangler is built to be more off road capable in stock form than the Liberty right from the factory. So it is more of a "what do you want it for" question. I have driven Wranglers and my KJ on and off road and that is my experience. The Liberty is pretty capable off road in it's own right though.

Dave

 

[eyehatetofu]

Try some trails out here,a stretched TJ makes doing shelfs/steps easier due to the longer wheelbase.Plus many like to do doublers and add D60's/14b's and gotta have a driveshaft longer then 6".Ever see a stock rear TJ driveshaft? It's about half the length of the KJ's.

LOL. Go back and read the other posts dude. What you are talking about isn't even relevant to the discussion. How does a stretched rig with Dana 60's and 14 bolts even get brought up in a KJ vs Wrangler discussion? What I stated earlier is true, a Wrangler with its shorter wheelbase and tighter turning radius will out maneuver, turn, steer a KJ. It just will. A SWB Wrangler will also have no problems on any obstacle that a KJ could make. I really don't even know what you are trying to get at at this point. :happy175:

You're really just missing all of my points -___-

I know a Wrangler is much better. I know hardly and KJs wheel. I know Wrangler owners wheel more often. And I know the two don't compare...

Sheesh I would have bought a TJ if I could afford it. I couldn't, so I bought the KJ. And I'm VERY happy and EXTREMELY impressed with it.

Ok. That wasn't what you were stating before. But anyways, glad you are happy with your Lib. I'm glad I own a KJ, and a sexy looking one at that.

 

[J-Thompson]

I have owned and wheeled both
The TJ is by far better off road
The KJ is better on road
However you give up more to own a KJ
if you go off road
I have modded my TJ to ride better on road
and it also improved how it handles off road
and you can not push a KJ very hard
or risk exploding the front diff
nor can you gear it low enough to go slow
and compensate for the weak first gear in the trans
The KK has changed some of and with the addition
of 245/75 M/T's and a lift to fit them
4.56 gears and lockers front and rear and it would be
real close to hanging with a stock 2 door JK Rubi.
better than any stock 4 door JK and just as good
as a stock TJ Rubicon
All of which could easily be modded and thus giving them
The off road upper hand

I would and have considered selling my modded TJ
to buy a WK or KK to mod and some what replace
the TJ because I just don't wheel like I did a few
years back I just don't have $20k+ to buy the Jeep
and another $5k+ to mod it on day 1

 

[tjkj2002]

LOL. Go back and read the other posts dude. What you are talking about isn't even relevant to the discussion. How does a stretched rig with Dana 60's and 14 bolts even get brought up in a KJ vs Wrangler discussion? What I stated earlier is true, a Wrangler with its shorter wheelbase and tighter turning radius will out maneuver, turn, steer a KJ. It just will. A SWB Wrangler will also have no problems on any obstacle that a KJ could make. I really don't even know what you are trying to get at at this point. :happy175:

The TJ or JK does not have a tighter turning raduis then a KJ or KK.The solid front axle limites turning raduis.

Really who doesn't mod there Jeep to some extent? You couldn't take a TJ or a KJ in places that either wouldn't need some pretty major mods to begin with.

I have owned and wheeled both
The TJ is by far better off road
The KJ is better on road
However you give up more to own a KJ
if you go off road
I have modded my TJ to ride better on road
and it also improved how it handles off road
and you can not push a KJ very hard
or risk exploding the front diff
nor can you gear it low enough to go slow
and compensate for the weak first gear in the trans
The KK has changed some of and with the addition
of 245/75 M/T's and a lift to fit them
4.56 gears and lockers front and rear and it would be
real close to hanging with a stock 2 door JK Rubi.
better than any stock 4 door JK and just as good
as a stock TJ Rubicon
All of which could easily be modded and thus giving them
The off road upper hand

I would and have considered selling my modded TJ
to buy a WK or KK to mod and some what replace
the TJ because I just don't wheel like I did a few
years back I just don't have $20k+ to buy the Jeep
and another $5k+ to mod it on day 1

I to have modded my KJ,like your TJ,and can push it as hard if not harder then your TJ without worry.Also most likely have a lower crawl ratio then your TJ since I have the better auto trans to start with.I've driven many modded TJ's and JK's and to tell you the truth they all rode like a$$,I've driven 8 wheeled drive wreckers(65 ton rated tow) with "G" rated tires that rode better then they did.

 

[J-Thompson]

Fact #1 my TJ rides better than a stock TJ
I made sure of it (better than most)
Fact #2 my TJ even on 33" tall tires turned tighter
than a stock KJ
Fact #3 the trans in you KJ will not and can not work
with out a TCM to tell it what to do it has the same first
and reverse ratio as mine however my TF999 dates back
to the early '70's during the time of carburetors
it can be modified to run with no electronic input at all
and still handle V8 power easily
It will work at much steeper angles than your prized
45RFE thus making my TF 999 better suited for off road
Now behind the trans is not stock making your point
about crawl ratio point less
However my stock axles will handle 5:13 but for some
odd reason I ,nor any TJ with a 4.0 for that matter, would
not need any thing deeper than 4.88 to smoke 35's
Just another one of those odd things about wranglers
Because I know that the FJ owners have the same issues
they need 4.56's to pull 33's where TJ's do fine and are
happy with 4.10's
Go figure

 

[tjkj2002]

Fact #1 my TJ rides better than a stock TJ
I made sure of it (better than most)
Fact #2 my TJ even on 33" tall tires turned tighter
than a stock KJ
Fact #3 the trans in you KJ will not and can not work
with out a TCM to tell it what to do it has the same first
and reverse ratio as mine however my TF999 dates back
to the early '70's during the time of carburetors
it can be modified to run with no electronic input at all
and still handle V8 power easily
It will work at much steeper angles than your prized
45RFE thus making my TF 999 better suited for off road
Now behind the trans is not stock making your point
about crawl ratio point less
However my stock axles will handle 5:13 but for some
odd reason I ,nor any TJ with a 4.0 for that matter, would
not need any thing deeper than 4.88 to smoke 35's
Just another one of those odd things about wranglers
Because I know that the FJ owners have the same issues
they need 4.56's to pull 33's where TJ's do fine and are
happy with 4.10's
Go figure

Stock turning radius for a Wrangler(not unlimited) is about 41',stock turning radius for a Liberty is 35'.


Unless you run RCV's(or the like) your not going to get better turning radius from a Wrangler without exploding the front diff u-joints.

 

[yellocoyote]

Apples and Oranges.

I don't compare them. I like them both, but for me the KJ fills my needs better

This.