Owning a CRD vs Owning a V6

[iamweasel]

I'm still trying to decide between buying a V6 or CRD. Before everyone starts shouting that this has been done before and going on about fuel consumption, what I'd like to establish here is what they're like to live with. Reliability, performance (off road?), user-friendliness etc.

After reading several CRD vs V6 posts around the net, they always revert to gas mileage, but after doing some research, ON AVERAGE the V6 doesn't seem to use THAT much more fuel than the CRD.
CRD: 20.8 MPG vs V6: 18.4 MPG on www.fuelly.com (averages only taken from 2006 models)
http://www.fuelly.com/car/jeep/liberty/diesel l4
http://www.fuelly.com/car/jeep/liberty/gas v6

So let's leave fuel consumption out of this post.

Basically what I'd like to establish is pros and cons of each. From what I've read, a big pro for the V6 is reliability. ...So what else?

 

[HoosierJeeper]

Pro's of the 3.7 (to me)
-Better part availability
-Less trouble some
-Don't need to do all kinds of mods just to make it as dependable
-Oil changes are less $$$

Cons:
-Less grunt
-Doesn't have the 5 speed, heavier duty ******
-Fuel Economy (more like 14-15 in down, about 20 on the highway)

CRD Pros:
-Grunt....nearly 300lbs torque at 1800 RPM
-Better ******
-Badge is cooler (haha)
-Fuel Economy (20+ in city, higher 20's on the highway)

Cons:
-Reliability
-Maintenance cost

I have a gasser, and I'm 110% happy with it, knock on wood it's been an awesome experience. Plus....I have a Land Rover (prone to problems and shop time) and enjoy having the simplicity of the Jeep, and do need one vehicle that's dependable enough where it can be my only vehicle at times. JMO.
Welcome to KJ Country.

PS: Look at getting an 05, look for one without ABS, Traction control or ESP, the ESP can get annoying from what I hear.

 

[moparman]

Big pro for the CRD - torque.

 

[LetFreedomRing]

Big Pro for gas is cheaper and availability of parts.

 

[moparman]

Doesn't the CRD need several fixes before it is trouble free?

 

[rockymountain]

I've heard one owner say it's best to have a second vehicle if you own a CRD.
if you want to lift it a CRD can't go as high.
I'd like to have one just to be different. Anyone have one they'd like to give me?

 

[Marlon_JB2]

Doesn't the CRD need several fixes before it is trouble free?

Yes.

3.7L FTW.

... I've had both. CRD is torquey, but overall isn't any faster than the 3.7L. Stronger transmission? ha.

 

[tjkj2002]

The transmission,mainly the torque converter,is one of the major downfalls for the CRD.You can get the same trans in a 3.7 KJ also(45RFE,same minus the 2nd OD and only in '02-early '03 3.7 KJ's).

Not to mention the $1000+ 100k service required for the CRD.

 

[iamweasel]

Thanks a lot guys.
So basically, reliability is the main issue with the CRD? Seems like any saving you might get from better fuel economy with the CRD is negated by repair costs.

Regardless of engine - which transmission is preferable? I'm in South Africa and I've seen both V6 and CRDs in Manual and Auto.

I'm limited to a vehicle no older than 5 years, so I'd more than likely be buying an '06

 

[Billwill]

Thanks a lot guys.
So basically, reliability is the main issue with the CRD? Seems like any saving you might get from better fuel economy with the CRD is negated by repair costs.

Regardless of engine - which transmission is preferable? I'm in South Africa and I've seen both V6 and CRDs in Manual and Auto.

I'm limited to a vehicle no older than 5 years, so I'd more than likely be buying an '06

I am also in South Africa and before buying my 2002 CRD I looked at road tests for both the 3.7L gas and the 2.5 L (at the time) CRD.
The differance in fuel economy made it a total no-brainer! I am very happy with my CRD....only needs a service every 20,000 kms and I have had very few problems with it.....love the torque!!
That said, I have seen on the various Jeep threads...mainly Lost...that the 2002 CRD was well put together as it was a new model but the later models have some issues...such as no longer having a lift pump to actualy pump the fuel out of the tank as the 2002/2003 models did.
If you are prepared to study the various forums for known problems/fixes for the newer CRDs then the CRD is still the better option in my opinion.
Oh and forget about getting decent dealership service here for any Jeep maintenance...you need to do as much as possible yourself!:disgust:

Edit to add: I have the manual gearbox...it is a bit rough and a pain in start/stop traffic....if I get another CRD it would be a 2.8 L with the auto box for sure!

 

[Marlon_JB2]

Believe me, you do NOT want the auto box.

IF it was offered with a manual transmission I'd have likely ended up special ordering one instead of taking one with the 545RFE.

Sorry but out of all the powertrain choices of the KJ or KK here in the US, I'll take the 3.7L/42RLE any day of the week. It's just.... reliable. Really, really reliable.

Regarding the NSG470 manual transmission which was placed in the later KJs/KKs... I do not have much experience with that combo, so I will not comment.

 

[LibertyTC]

What does C R D stand for anyways?
Crappy Diesel? Or Continuously Repairing Diesel Or Contemplating Replacing Diesel?
I am sure there must be a few happy CRD owners somewhere.
(CRD section) is the place to gain insight.
In general all diesel engines require higher maintenance and much more frequent service$.
When something does go wrong, it is difficult to get part$ and find someone qualified to do the repairs. The cost of repair$ can & will be substantial.
I am with Marlon get a gas 3.7 and 42RLE. My 04 is discs, without ABS and none of this traction control computerized crap. This is good... keep it simple & reliable.
How many times have I heard about TPMS and $80 per sensor, and lights on. So glad I don't have them either.

 

[Doublecardan]

I have been around diesels for quite a long time, from the 6.2/6.9 of the early days, engines that nearly did in the diesel to the 7.3/6.0 and now 6.4 for ford and the 5.9 to 6.7 cummins all the way up to the 15 liter bigguns in the big stuff. There is only one word for Diesel and thats it tremendous torque...Other than in big trucks, it has nothing else going for it. It stinks, makes too much noise and is not worth the extra cost. I understand that in countries in Europe Diesels are very popluar due the obscene price of fuel they have to pay, or rather the excessive tax on the fuel so that makes diesel a fuel of choice by default rather than its merits. Here in Canada, Diesel is still a niche market, most people buy them looking at only fuel economy which the op steered away from as it should be there are other areas to look at. They are not very good in cold weather although they have gotten better, they still stink, get behind a jeep grand cherokee with the 3 liter, what a pong...Gas is still the only way to go. sorry longwinded but i leave with this survey that was done in Canada, 50 percent of surveyed diesel owners who bought new, (Volks, Audi, GM, Ford, Pentastar) said they would not buy another (maintance was too high and fuel was still not worth it). 80 percent of people surveyed that bought a used diesel said they would not buy one again.....80 percent was not a real surprise, the 50 percent was...

 

[diyman]

LibertyTC, Doublecardan, couldn't have said it better ......(Cheers)

Also Marlon, I've driven some Diesels and, IMO, applying that 'torque' many seem to like so much, via a clutch,
is annoying to say the least. Billwill said that right. I'd also go fo an auto if 'forced' into buying a diesel...

Billwill, don't know Your driving habits, road conditions etc etc over there, but, IMHO, 20,000 is asking too much to
Your oil....I know some are capable, but not with a 5 qt sump. I'd guess that schedule 'B' applies to You, 10,000 km.

I don't wanna know the TBN ( sort of Ph... ) after that mileage (the 20,000 I mean).....#-o
Car makers try to lure customers into thinking their vehicles need little maintenance, not me!

 

[Ry' N Jen]

My parents have a VW Jetta TDI and yes, it gets 1200+ km to the tank...
But the amount of money they have poured into that car since new, just in scheduled maintenance is ********!

I'm glad our KJ has the 3.7 liter under the hood

 

[Doublecardan]

Around where i work, with all the diesels our company uses, (even they are starting to see the light) we have all kinds of good nicknames for the diesel trucks and cars.

Ford Diesels... Powerstroke----powerjoke
GM durajunk (over 1500 for a fuel pump)
Dodge---Diesel on Dodge Gutless Engine
TDI--Tutonic Dumkopf Import
The GL model on the back of jettas and golfs---means german lemon
bluetec----still stinks as peeyou tec

Actually, I do not critize anybody who drives one, each has his own needs, and variety does make the world go around.

 

[LibertyTC]

What ever happened to the million mile diesels idea?
Or is it the block can last million miles, but everything else has been replaced 5 times?
In other words: Completely Rebuilding Diesel

 

[iamweasel]

Thanks again for all the replies.

From my calculations the fuel saving of the CRD is only worth about R300 ($45) a month to me, so it's a non-issue. I drive a diesel currently - Audi TDI - and I love the torque and economy, but I'm tired of turbo lag and turbo repairs (had to overhaul mine). So any "fuel saving" / "diesel economy" seems to be a moot point.

Seems like the V6 is the way to go then...

Believe me, you do NOT want the auto box.

do you mean the CRD auto box? (545RFE)

Would the 42RLE be preferable to a manual? I do like the idea of the 6 speed manual (have one in my Audi)

Once again, thanks for all the input. Looking forward to going Jeep shopping soon

 

[Billwill]

LibertyTC, Doublecardan, couldn't have said it better ......(Cheers)

Also Marlon, I've driven some Diesels and, IMO, applying that 'torque' many seem to like so much, via a clutch,
is annoying to say the least. Billwill said that right. I'd also go fo an auto if 'forced' into buying a diesel...

Billwill, don't know Your driving habits, road conditions etc etc over there, but, IMHO, 20,000 is asking too much to
Your oil....I know some are capable, but not with a 5 qt sump. I'd guess that schedule 'B' applies to You, 10,000 km.

I don't wanna know the TBN ( sort of Ph... ) after that mileage (the 20,000 I mean).....#-o
Car makers try to lure customers into thinking their vehicles need little maintenance, not me!

The 20,000 km service interval comes straight out of the owners manual...using pure synthetic oil. I pretty much do most of my travelling on the open road...hardly any sand roads and no off-road stuff and have had no problems so far!

 

[diyman]

The 20,000 km service interval comes straight out of the owners manual...using pure synthetic oil. I pretty much do most of my travelling on the open road...hardly any sand roads and no off-road stuff and have had no problems so far!

It's alright then, this means You are on schedule 'A' ( per FSM and owners manual ).
Not trying to force You into wasting good oil...I know that throughout the world it may not be cheap
Manuals don't emphasize that enough, but dust/sand ( then not Your case ) are engines' worst enemy..
Air filters do what they can....

Being that (dust) my situation, I'm forced into changing oil, even good ones, every 3/3.5 kmiles