Engine knocking/clicking 03 Liberty

[Shima]

Good morning,

Thank you guys for a great forum with tons of Jeep info. I used the thread related to the AC bypass recently, and it help out and saved $$. Anyway, does anyone know if a knocking/ticking sound that seems to be coming from the front passenger side of the engine is something to be concerned about? I have an 03 Liberty 3.7. It become more noticeable after I removed the AC compressor. I have 161,000 miles and it's gradually become a bit louder. It burns about a quart of oil per 3000 mile change. From what I've read online there isn't one main cause (pretty much with most engines), but some mentioned values or maybe lifters. Maybe it will go another 50,000 like this, but who knows. Finally, would it be worth rebuilding and what good shops or companies are out there for this type of work? I hate to see the paid off Libby go, and it's a blast to drive and has been mechanically sound since I bought it with 81,000 on it. Thanks!

 

[TwoBobsKJ]

(welcome)

See this thread on an option if the engine ends up waving bye-bye. Before you get there, though, it could be a rocker arm - especially on the #2 cylinder (the front one on the passenger side.) They have been known to come off and some report a ticking sound before they do.

However, given that you're burning some oil and you describe the sound as a 'knock' I would expect the problem is deeper in the engine than that. Mine started out as a come-and-go tap/knock that eventually became a nasty bang - see the video in the link above.

The good news is you DO have options to keep your Libby around for a long time with a new or nearly new engine should you choose to go that route. Lots of knowledge on here to help you make your choices.

Let us know what you're thinking...

Bob

 

[J'sJeep]

Sounds like a possible tensioner going bad. If the A/C is no longer in the picture it could put more stress on tensioner perhaps and cause it to get worse or be noticeable. At least it is a good starting point since you were dabbling in that area already, right? Hope this is your answer. It's cheap n easy to fix compared to a lot of problems...

-J

 

[mikeandamy]

Sounds like a possible tensioner going bad. If the A/C is no longer in the picture it could put more stress on tensioner perhaps and cause it to get worse or be noticeable. At least it is a good starting point since you were dabbling in that area already, right? Hope this is your answer. It's cheap n easy to fix compared to a lot of problems...

-J

I did the same A/C bypass and belt reroute and maybe a coincidence but my tensioner is now making a rattling noise. I think it needs to be replaced, I just haven't had the time to get to it.

 

[Shima]

Thanks for the info guys - I really appreciate it. I will recheck the tensioner, although I believe it's something engine related. If I could get lucky enough with a tensioner that would be awesome. One other thing I've noticed is that the sound is not so noticeable at warm up or a bit higher rpms, it seems to be more pronounced at idle when warm. I a will shoot a video and add to my Youtube channel and put a link here if that is permitted. Also, TwoBobsKJ, what options for engine replacement are best and affordable. Also, would you replace or rebuild the transmission at the same time? The only problem I've had with that is a slow engagement when going into reverse or drive when cold and it will hesitate - Almost like a skip and then it engages. I read somewhere this is a common Liberty problem or maybe the rear diff. TwoBobsKJ - That is one bad **** Renegade you have by the way! J'sJeep - Hope it's not too cold in the UP after the snow. It's warming up here in GR after a light freeze overnight.

 

[JeepCoMJ]

take the serpentine belt OFF then start it. if it still makes the noise, it's a rocker going bad, or a timing chain guide or tensioner going bad.

If it doesn't make the noise, then assume it's the serpentine tensioner rattlng.

 

[Shima]

Thanks JeepCoMJ. I didn't think of taking off the belt. I will have the wife watch the temp gage while we run it with the belt off, so we don't overheat it. Since it's only apparent when it warms up, have to take for a quick drive with the belt on, then take it off and test for the noise.

 

[JeepCoMJ]

get it to temp to make the noise, remove the belt completely from the engine bay. don't just remove tension and leave it hanging, or it could snag on the harmonic balancer and come whipping around.

If the problem is gone, it's in the serpentine system. if still there, it's more likely than not a valvetrain issue.

any CEL codes coming up? low compression cylinder two? if so, you've got a dropped valve seat, broken valve spring, or bent valve. but that wouldn't explain the noise only after warm-up.

 

[Shima]

I was able to test it with no serpentine belt. Here is the Youtube video:

Jeep Liberty Renegade 2003 knocking/rattling from engine - YouTube

It sounds pretty close to the same to me when running with the belt. I am wondering how many more miles I can get out of this engine before it dies. I haven't tested for compression yet, and there are no codes logged so far. Let me know what you guys think. Also, when I shut if off after the no belt test it leaked a little bit of anti-freeze from under the water pump, or maybe one of the hoses, but after putting it back on and testing it seems fine with no leaks. I am thinking it just pressurized and leaked past a hose clamp when the fan/water pump wasn't moving.

 

[JeepCoMJ]

that is a collapsed lifter and bad rocker. valves are likely to be fine.

 

[JeepCoMJ]

you need to move everything out of the way to remove the valve cover, and take some pics.

 

[Shima]

JeepCoMJ thanks for the diagnosis. Do you think this is something worth fixing without rebuilding, or is it best to rebuild the whole engine? Does it explain the oil burning about 1 qt per 3000 mile change? Hopefully, I can keep driving it until it's time to fix it. Thanks again for the help.

 

[hillbillyhotrod]

i had something similar...... went thru the whole process of changing lifters and then doing the heads to find out the timing chain was bad and then it broke and once that was replaced the noise was still there.

Turned out the no 2 cylinder on left bank was the issue. the con rod on the little end that has the gudgeon pin was going oval and making the rattling noise.

 

[Shima]

hillbillyhotrod - thanks for the heads up. I actually had a mechanic friend listen to the engine and we test drove it as well. He thinks it still has quite a bit of life left, so I am actually going to replace the AC compressor that I removed and get it working again and keep driving it, as far as it will last. When I go for a rebuild, I've heard Jasper engines are one of the best, but I was looking into Accurate Engines as well. Accurate is close here in Michigan, but I need to research them a bit more.

 

[TwoBobsKJ]

hillbillyhotrod - thanks for the heads up. I actually had a mechanic friend listen to the engine and we test drove it as well. He thinks it still has quite a bit of life left, so I am actually going to replace the AC compressor that I removed and get it working again and keep driving it, as far as it will last. When I go for a rebuild, I've heard Jasper engines are one of the best, but I was looking into Accurate Engines as well. Accurate is close here in Michigan, but I need to research them a bit more.

Here is an option if you find the rebuild/reman route too expensive.

Bob

 

[Shima]

In reading another thread this morning about rear suspension, I realized it's been 2 years since I posted about the engine tick/knock my Liberty has. Needless to say, it's still running pretty well with 180,500 miles, and I've recently rebuilt the front suspension and am working on the back. I do have to tackle some of the plastic and rubber hoses around around the engine as they are cracking and wearing out with heat over time. Maybe someone can recommend a place to get them? Anyway, with all the work, I might as well keep it running well for some time to come, as no car payments are nice.

 

[luvmykj]

I am experiencing the same probles in my 02 the skipping hesitation from reverse to drive and also just started getting the ticking....... I need help.

 

[jeepbeep]

If it's timing chain tensioners or main bearings just swap a used LKQ engine in; $1,200 gets you 120k with a warranty. Anything in the head(worn valve seat, worn lashing, worn spring(these are OHC engines)) just replace the whole head with a rebuilt and new hardware.

The belt tensioner is cheap though.

Reasons:

1. All procedures require precision machining and acid baths
2. You'll pay a few hundred more tops for the swap in all but the head-case because of labor cost(if you're lucky)
3. It ends up being more economical to keep that old engine and have it rebuilt over time

How I know any of this: First-hand experience within the last two years. Mechanics don't care if you give them your business or not they have plenty of insurance and passer by business. They will get loose when shooting you a quote.. If you have to go to a job and need the vehicle for that you're in an even tighter spot. If you go in to having it rebuilt or trying to do specific fixes you're likely to spend the cost of another liberty inside six-months. With specific fixes the mechanics won't even mention suspecting other problems just to get the extra money later.