Brighter Lights for Dark Sky Ordinances in Arizona and Riverside County

[003Liberty]

Hi,
Just joined the forum. As the days shorten, it's almost impossible to drive my '03 Liberty at night in Arizona and Riverside County, which have "Dark Skies Ordinances." They use dark, amber colored street lights. Once you get to LA county, it gets bright again, but then in Ventura County, they also have an ordinance, and it gets dark again coming up the hill out of LA.

All the newer cars have LED's and other types of "hot, white lights" that blind me. My old yellow lights can't keep up with them. I want something that's just as white.

Of course you all know the potential over the counter solutions - which one is the best between the 55W/65W Sylvania Silverstar Ultras (O'reilly and Auto Zone), and the NAPA 80W/100W Xenon, from "Street Glow" -
https://www.napaonline.com/napa/en/...sInterchange=true&referer=search_form-allprod

Will 80W/100W blind oncoming cars or melt the wiring and wiring harnass or even the lamp?

What's your best recommendation?

There's also stuff like this at O'Reilly. Despite all the fancy packaging, I have no idea what really works -
Sylvania SilverStar zXe 9007SZ/2BP - Headlight Bulb | O'Reilly Auto Parts

Thank you.

 

[jeeplib05]

Don't bother with Sylvania's
I had the "ZXE" which they claim is comparable to an HID and it wasn't even close
I personally have 5,000k HIDs and love them
Crisp, white light and I don't blind anyone
Also, if you have fogs you can upgrade those as well, if not then get some nice fogs and they'll help
I added some LED fog lights to my 05 and they give off some decent light but nowhere close to what an HID will

 

[003Liberty]

Don't bother with Sylvania's
I had the "ZXE" which they claim is comparable to an HID and it wasn't even close
I personally have 5,000k HIDs and love them
Crisp, white light and I don't blind anyone
Also, if you have fogs you can upgrade those as well, if not then get some nice fogs and they'll help
I added some LED fog lights to my 05 and they give off some decent light but nowhere close to what an HID will

Excellent! That's what I wanted to find out - I suspected the Sylvanias wouldn't do anything.
In this market they also have the ZXE, too.

I don't know if I want to do an HID conversion. Only unless I have to. Which I may have to, unless there's any positive results of "plug-in" upgrades actually making a difference.

Are the NAPA Xenon 85/100W going to make any difference?

Yes, it has fog lights, too. I would definitely do those as well.

 

[jeeplib05]

Honestly couldn't tell you as I've never used them
I would assume they would help compared to stock but no halogen will be brighter than an HID
That's why I got sick of always having to buy halogens, yellow light and they don't last that long
My HIDs are pure white, don't get dim, and I've never had one burn out on me (I had them in my old Pontiac for over 2 1/2 years and they still looked brand new)
I angle mine down slightly and get plenty of down road light without blinding people so I'm very happy with my conversion
Oh and if you did fogs too, you'd have tons of light

 

[003Liberty]

Honestly couldn't tell you as I've never used them
I would assume they would help compared to stock but no halogen will be brighter than an HID
That's why I got sick of always having to buy halogens, yellow light and they don't last that long
My HIDs are pure white, don't get dim, and I've never had one burn out on me (I had them in my old Pontiac for over 2 1/2 years and they still looked brand new)
I angle mine down slightly and get plenty of down road light without blinding people so I'm very happy with my conversion
Oh and if you did fogs too, you'd have tons of light

These NAPA bulbs are Xenon. Would the 80W/100W overwhelm the system and melt the wires? Could you Private message me the HID's you use as you mention in your other post?

AZ law says it cannot project more than 70 feet. Mine are only going about 30 feet. I cannot imagine how increasing from 55W to 80W would increase beyond 70 feet - Do you agree ???



28-924. Motor vehicle head lamps
A. A motor vehicle other than a motorcycle, an all-terrain vehicle or a motor driven cycle shall be equipped with at least two head lamps with at least one on each side of the front of the motor vehicle. The head lamps shall comply with the requirements and limitations of this article.

B. A motorcycle, an all-terrain vehicle and a motor driven cycle shall be equipped with at least one and not more than two head lamps that comply with the requirements and limitations of this article.

C. A head lamp on a motor vehicle, including a motorcycle, an all-terrain vehicle and a motor driven cycle, shall be located at a height of not more than fifty-four inches nor less than twenty-two inches to be measured as provided in section 28-923, subsection B.

28-947. Special restrictions on lamps

A. A person shall direct a lighted lamp or illuminating device on a motor vehicle, other than a head lamp, spot lamp, auxiliary lamp or flashing front direction signal, that projects a beam of light of an intensity greater than three hundred candlepower so that no part of the beam strikes the level of the roadway on which the vehicle stands at a distance of more than seventy-five feet from the vehicle.


B. A person shall not drive or move a vehicle or equipment on a highway with a lamp or device on the vehicle that is capable of displaying a red or red and blue light or lens visible from directly in front of the center of the vehicle. Lights visible from the front of a vehicle shall be amber or white.

 

[tommudd]

Phillips Extreme in the headlights and then some good driving/ fog lights
be good, safe and legal and not blinding others

 

[JasonJ]

Excellent! That's what I wanted to find out - I suspected the Sylvanias wouldn't do anything.
In this market they also have the ZXE, too.

I don't know if I want to do an HID conversion. Only unless I have to. Which I may have to, unless there's any positive results of "plug-in" upgrades actually making a difference.

Are the NAPA Xenon 85/100W going to make any difference?

Yes, it has fog lights, too. I would definitely do those as well.

"Have to" ? Well, people have been driving through the Western US for 100 years with crappier headlights than what is on a stock KJ. I doubt that you have to... I mean, we didn't all struggle before the invention of HID headlights. So while you can go that route if you want, I'm sure there are also alternatives.

The Xenon bulbs wont melt wiring by being xenon in and of itself; however the 80/100w rating may draw more amperage than the stock wiring can handle. Whatever you do, an upgraded relay wiring harness for the headlights is HIGHLY recommended, and other than doing what JeepLib05 did, will net the best results.

These NAPA bulbs are Xenon. Would the 80W/100W overwhelm the system and melt the wires? Could you Private message me the HID's you use as you mention in your other post?

AZ law says it cannot project more than 70 feet. Mine are only going about 30 feet. I cannot imagine how increasing from 55W to 80W would increase beyond 70 feet - Do you agree ???



28-924. Motor vehicle head lamps
A. A motor vehicle other than a motorcycle, an all-terrain vehicle or a motor driven cycle shall be equipped with at least two head lamps with at least one on each side of the front of the motor vehicle. The head lamps shall comply with the requirements and limitations of this article.

B. A motorcycle, an all-terrain vehicle and a motor driven cycle shall be equipped with at least one and not more than two head lamps that comply with the requirements and limitations of this article.

C. A head lamp on a motor vehicle, including a motorcycle, an all-terrain vehicle and a motor driven cycle, shall be located at a height of not more than fifty-four inches nor less than twenty-two inches to be measured as provided in section 28-923, subsection B.

28-947. Special restrictions on lamps

A. A person shall direct a lighted lamp or illuminating device on a motor vehicle, other than a head lamp, spot lamp, auxiliary lamp or flashing front direction signal, that projects a beam of light of an intensity greater than three hundred candlepower so that no part of the beam strikes the level of the roadway on which the vehicle stands at a distance of more than seventy-five feet from the vehicle.


B. A person shall not drive or move a vehicle or equipment on a highway with a lamp or device on the vehicle that is capable of displaying a red or red and blue light or lens visible from directly in front of the center of the vehicle. Lights visible from the front of a vehicle shall be amber or white.

FIFY. It says OTHER THAN A HEAD LAMP. So it would be referring to accessory lighting, possibly fog lights (which you would not want to project that far anyhow).

It sounds to me that there is something not correct with your headlights. Can you take some pictures out in the dark of what their output looks like, both on road and off?

If you are still using factory bulbs, and they've been in there a while, also be aware that halogen bulbs dim greatly over time.

I think that with an upgraded relay harness, Phillips Xtreme bulbs, clean your headlight lenses to crystal clear, upgrade driving lamps to 9005 bulbs instead of 9145's, and properly align them all, you'll be fine.

If it's still an issue at that point, either put a pair of long range off-road lights on the front end, or consider an HID retrofit of questionable legality.

 

[003Liberty]

"Have to" ? Well, people have been driving through the Western US for 100 years with crappier headlights than what is on a stock KJ. I doubt that you have to... I mean, we didn't all struggle before the invention of HID headlights. So while you can go that route if you want, I'm sure there are also alternatives.

The Xenon bulbs wont melt wiring by being xenon in and of itself; however the 80/100w rating may draw more amperage than the stock wiring can handle. Whatever you do, an upgraded relay wiring harness for the headlights is HIGHLY recommended, and other than doing what JeepLib05 did, will net the best results.





FIFY. It says OTHER THAN A HEAD LAMP. So it would be referring to accessory lighting, possibly fog lights (which you would not want to project that far anyhow).

It sounds to me that there is something not correct with your headlights. Can you take some pictures out in the dark of what their output looks like, both on road and off?

If you are still using factory bulbs, and they've been in there a while, also be aware that halogen bulbs dim greatly over time.

I think that with an upgraded relay harness, Phillips Xtreme bulbs, clean your headlight lenses to crystal clear, upgrade driving lamps to 9005 bulbs instead of 9145's, and properly align them all, you'll be fine.

If it's still an issue at that point, either put a pair of long range off-road lights on the front end, or consider an HID retrofit of questionable legality.

Yes in terms of horrible headlights for a hundred years. However, in areas of the Southwest with "Dark Sky Ordinances," when you have a busy street with lots of cars blinding you with newer lights + cyclists and pedestrians on the street, then it's dangerous. Best to upgrade - to something. Most people have upgraded or have newer cars. I counted cars and only 10% in metro Phoenix had older yellow bulbs.

I am sure that the halogens have dimmed over time. I have cleaned the housings as much as I can.

If you live in L.A. County you don't have to worry about dark sky ordinances.

 

[003Liberty]

Phillips extreme on Amazon claims they do NOT fit a 2003 Liberty - I entered 2003 Liberty -

https://www.amazon.com/Philips-X-tr...automotive&vehicleId=1&vehicleType=automotive

 

[tommudd]

Phillips extreme on Amazon claims they do NOT fit a 2003 Liberty - I entered 2003 Liberty -

https://www.amazon.com/Philips-X-tr...automotive&vehicleId=1&vehicleType=automotive

Thats where I got mine just a few months ago. Try just looking for the 9007s
all the same 2002-2007

 

[003Liberty]

Reason why Lights are Dark FOUND !

It sounds to me that there is something not correct with your headlights. Can you take some pictures out in the dark of what their output looks like, both on road and off?

If you are still using factory bulbs, and they've been in there a while, also be aware that halogen bulbs dim greatly over time.

I think that with an upgraded relay harness, Phillips Xtreme bulbs, clean your headlight lenses to crystal clear, upgrade driving lamps to 9005 bulbs instead of 9145's, and properly align them all, you'll be fine.

If it's still an issue at that point, either put a pair of long range off-road lights on the front end, or consider an HID retrofit of questionable legality.

You're correct!

I looked again today, and here's the reason ! The previous owner installed a Brush Guard that was possibly installed incorrectly ! IT seems to be too small. It is preventing the main lights from properly illuminating THE SIDES of the road, where the bikes and pedestrians are !!! Possibly up to 20% of the total field of view is blocked!

However, I noted that if the lights were brighter, and if the FOG LIGHTS were brighter, then there would be more light out to the side.

I also parked in a Wallmart parking lot in an areas of Phoenix that has strict Dark Skies (Deer Valley, AZ). I watched cars go by, and again, noted that 70% to 90% of cars are either new, or, have upgraded. The brighter cars are at least 40% brighter than mine with the old halogens.

Thanks.

 

[003Liberty]

Don't bother with Sylvania's
I had the "ZXE" which they claim is comparable to an HID and it wasn't even close
I personally have 5,000k HIDs and love them
Crisp, white light and I don't blind anyone
Also, if you have fogs you can upgrade those as well, if not then get some nice fogs and they'll help
I added some LED fog lights to my 05 and they give off some decent light but nowhere close to what an HID will

Dear jeeplib05,

The private messaging service stopped working.

If you email privately again I'll probably get it. But for some reason, I can't email you back.

Since the fog lights are plastic housing, would they melt with 55W bulbs ???

The regular lights are glass housing.

I'm going to have my custom jeep guy look at the above.

He will also be interested in this modification.

He can go off road, all over AZ. But my transmission isn't doing well so I don't.

Which is another topic, the defective 02-03 jeep liberty TX's and the P1776 lights. Save that for later.

For me, it's just the pedestrians and cyclists, and the deer and javelina (A vicious animal in the desert), that I don't want to run into ! :Bye:

Thank you.

 

[JasonJ]

I'd be interested to see what the voltage drop is AT the headlight socket/bulb itself. Do you have a DVOM/Multimeter?

Unless your lenses are piss yellow, I've never seen a Lib with as $hitty of headlights as you are describing.

If the headlights and driving lamps are running at their best, perhaps you just need to stick a pair of Hella style off-road lights in front of the grille and leave it at that.

 

[jeeplib05]

My headlight housings are brand new but halogens just don't give me the light I want/need
Which is the whole reason I upgraded to HIDs
This is what mine look like, they are angled down to not blind oncoming traffic and light is not scattered nor directed straight to the ground (as you can see the road isn't flat so you don't get the full light spread as you would on flat ground but you still get the idea):

You must be registered for see images attach

Also you can see that they are not blinding until you are pretty low to the ground, this picture was taken at roughly 3ft (maybe slightly less), which is right where it begins to get bright
But this height is lower than almost anyone would be sitting in a typical car (besides those ricers I guess):

You must be registered for see images attach

I've sat in 3 different vehicles, two small cars and a CR-V, to test my headlights and they have not blinded me, nor have I ever been flashed for them in the KJ driving down the road

 

[tommudd]

...........

 

[jeeplib05]

These pictures were for the OP
Not sure what the "..........." are for
I should've taken a better picture on a flat road since it appears they are much brighter in the center than they are on a typical road
But nonetheless, try getting THAT output with some Phillips "extremes" bulbs :waytogo:
Of course everyone knows, cell phones do no light justice, on top of these pictures being posted blurry for some reason..
The spread may look a little off because of this but they do give off great, un-scattered light unlike what you guys think :Big Laugh:

 

[JasonJ]

At least we didn't degenerate into talking about aircraft landing lights...

Doh! I just mentioned them!

At this point, I think the OP has a few options open and available. It's going to be up to the OP what to do from here.

 

[dude1116]

I don't like when people have super bright HIDs in halogen housings when I'm in my TC.

 

[tommudd]

At least we didn't degenerate into talking about aircraft landing lights...

Doh! I just mentioned them!

At this point, I think the OP has a few options open and available. It's going to be up to the OP what to do from here.

:happy175:
And..........whats wrong with aircraft landing lights?
Much much better than HIDs in stock housings
and if you want bright / blinding others , why not :happy175::happy175::emotions34::mwah1:
I may have in the past and may occasionally even now break some rules, but never will you see me putting something into a headlight that is totally illegal

 

[jeeplib05]

OK well once, if I ever, run into issues with them regarding other people/the law I will reconsider
But for now, I will continue to use them and have great light to make me feel safe driving down dark roads
I have zero problems using them so carry on with dim halogens :happy175: