How much does the lift increase the risk of rollover?

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hyde

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Yes, I am sure it mostly depends on the height of the lift plus the tires and rims it is running on, but generally would you say that Lift increases the rollover risk at the same corner or turn by certain percentage?

I would assume there is a significant risk since Chrysler lowered the KJs due to increased rollover risk, and airborne tires.

I don't do off-road but I would like to get a lift so I can get better tires for my 17" rims, or change the rims all together and get better looking tires, but I tend to drive as if my jeep was a sedan, so I don't want to end up on my roof upside down. (Aeh)
 

tjkj2002

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I tend to drive as if my jeep was a sedan
If that's the case you need to lower your KJ (whistle) ,If you drive a KJ likes it's a car your chances of rolling a really great(stock hieght) you lift it and you most likely end up on your top.Not to be a ***** or anything but you can't drive it like a sedan,that's why alot of poeple are trying to get all SUV's banned because they have a higher roll over %,it's more like the poeple driving the SUV's are not trained to drive SUV's but only cars and end up rolling them.Even in a KJ the center of gravity is higher than any car so it's more likely to roll if drivin like a car.You gotta slow down will turning and use extreme caution when doing high speed lane changes.Again I'm not trying to be a ***** but you gotta drive your KJ like a SUV and not a car then you can lift it,tires are not going to help no matter how much grip they provide.When that top heavy KJ wants to go over it's going over.
 

hyde

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tjkj2002, I am aware of this issue and working on it. 8-[ However, I have never driven a sedan for a long time.. I used to drive caravan but again, that was never long term either.

My first long term vehicle was Jeep Grand Cherokee from 96.. 2x4 !, and later I got myself a KJ. So, although I drive it like a car, I don't drive it like a sports car. I am aware of the height, and I am always careful when turning.

My tires always tell me when I am pushing it.. So actually better tires might be worse since they will grip better; causing higher center of gravity to push and might roll over. Am I wrong?
 

tjkj2002

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My tires always tell me when I am pushing it.. So actually better tires might be worse since they will grip better; causing higher center of gravity to push and might roll over. Am I wrong?
You are right. Sorry if I sounded rude but didn't want you to become another number that all those anti-SUV'ers can use against us.Just stay safe and have you ever thought about going to 16" rims,the tire selection is a little better for 16" rims.
 

hyde

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tjkj2002 said:
You are right. Sorry if I sounded rude but didn't want you to become another number that all those anti-SUV'ers can use against us.Just stay safe and have you ever thought about going to 16" rims,the tire selection is a little better for 16" rims.

No no, I totally agree with what you said, I didn't even think you were rude. :) My point was that when tires slide a little it prevents rollover. So by keeping my crappy tires, I avoid rollover? Is there such a thing?

I thought about going to 16" but I really love the way my rims look. Unless I could get a great deal on moabs with perfect set of tires, I couldn't afford to change them just yet.
 

tjkj2002

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hyedipin said:
tjkj2002 said:
You are right. Sorry if I sounded rude but didn't want you to become another number that all those anti-SUV'ers can use against us.Just stay safe and have you ever thought about going to 16" rims,the tire selection is a little better for 16" rims.

No no, I totally agree with what you said, I didn't even think you were rude. :) My point was that when tires slide a little it prevents rollover. So by keeping my crappy tires, I avoid rollover? Is there such a thing?

I thought about going to 16" but I really love the way my rims look. Unless I could get a great deal on moabs with perfect set of tires, I couldn't afford to change them just yet.
Well when I think of 17" rims I think sticky performance radials,there is not much for AT or MT tire selection that will fit a KJ even with a lift.If you stick with a AT tire you will be fine,they should slide before enough g-force is applied to roll.Heck I'm trying to go to 15" rims.by the end of the year I'll have 15" rims and a whole lot more ssst.gif .
 

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I've got to say that if you're talkin'about a 2.5" coil lift, the upgrade in quality of the shocks/struts/coils over the OEM setup more than makes up for any hgt. increase. "Seat of the pants" feel is much better than with the stock components. Just my $.02 worth. :-k
 

K Dje Ryu

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sgoat said:
I've got to say that if you're talkin'about a 2.5" coil lift, the upgrade in quality of the shocks/struts/coils over the OEM setup more than makes up for any hgt. increase. "Seat of the pants" feel is much better than with the stock components. Just my $.02 worth. :-k

I was thinking the same thing. Mine sure feels like it sways and rocks a lot less than it did before I lifted it. I actually feel like I can take corners a bit faster now. Not that I do but, it feels like I could. Now, when I had the RRO OTT budget lift in it, I definitely think it would have rolled a lot easier then; I slowed down for everything with it!
 

hyde

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tjkj2002 said:
Well when I think of 17" rims I think sticky performance radials,there is not much for AT or MT tire selection that will fit a KJ even with a lift.
If you stick with a AT tire you will be fine,they should slide before enough g-force is applied to roll.Heck I'm trying to go to 15" rims.by the end of the year I'll have 15" rims and a whole lot more ssst.gif .

Thanks.
Well, tires are different topic, but since we brought it up, I was thinking of going with Scorpion ATR since it has superb rating on everything in it's line from off-road to snow, from wet to highway.. However I am not sure about the difference of 235/65HR17 as opposed to my R17's.

Again I will have to choose between On-/Off-Road All-Terrain (Pirelli ATR since that's the only one with my size) with possible highway sliding OR go with Highway All-Season that will stick somewhat better.

sgoat, thanks for the information, I know what you mean, that will cause stiffer ride, therefore "rocking" will be less. However, eventhough I am thinking of getting lift, it will be pretty difficult to get a quality mechanic to install those components properly in my area.
 

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K Dje Ryu said:
sgoat said:
I've got to say that if you're talkin'about a 2.5" coil lift, the upgrade in quality of the shocks/struts/coils over the OEM setup more than makes up for any hgt. increase. "Seat of the pants" feel is much better than with the stock components. Just my $.02 worth. :-k

I was thinking the same thing. Mine sure feels like it sways and rocks a lot less than it did before I lifted it. I actually feel like I can take corners a bit faster now. Not that I do but, it feels like I could. Now, when I had the RRO OTT budget lift in it, I definitely think it would have rolled a lot easier then; I slowed down for everything with it!

I'm going to have to disagree with both of you. IMO if you lift it 2.5" to 3" you will tip easier unless you widen the stance by the same. As far as how much the risk of rollover is increased? I dunno.
 

Corwyyn

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cowdogg said:
I'm going to have to disagree with both of you. IMO if you lift it 2.5" to 3" you will tip easier unless you widen the stance by the same. As far as how much the risk of rollover is increased? I dunno.
Well, considering that most who install a lift also upgrade to something like a 245/75 tire then it's probably a wash, especially if they go with a rim with more backspace. Those two items would widen the stance a good three inches at least...
 

K Dje Ryu

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cowdogg said:
K Dje Ryu said:
sgoat said:
I've got to say that if you're talkin'about a 2.5" coil lift, the upgrade in quality of the shocks/struts/coils over the OEM setup more than makes up for any hgt. increase. "Seat of the pants" feel is much better than with the stock components. Just my $.02 worth. :-k

I was thinking the same thing. Mine sure feels like it sways and rocks a lot less than it did before I lifted it. I actually feel like I can take corners a bit faster now. Not that I do but, it feels like I could. Now, when I had the RRO OTT budget lift in it, I definitely think it would have rolled a lot easier then; I slowed down for everything with it!

I'm going to have to disagree with both of you. IMO if you lift it 2.5" to 3" you will tip easier unless you widen the stance by the same. As far as how much the risk of rollover is increased? I dunno.

I thought the same thing before installing Rusty's springs and struts. I also put in Daystar's anti-sway bar bushings so that may help but, it really doesn't feel like it would tip over as easily as it did when I first got it... maybe it would if I had taller tires but, right now, it feels like it would just slide but my tires are pretty bald at the moment. I'm not about to try it just to find out, though. I know it's a very top-heavy vehicle so I probably go slower around most corners (and even just curves) a lot slower than I need to. Better safe than sorry, right? One of the things that defines a happy Jeep owner is being passed by blue-haired old ladies on the highway and not caring, isn't it? As long as it will climb walls, I don't care how slow it is. \:D/
 

hyde

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K Dje Ryu said:
As long as it will climb walls, I don't care how slow it is. \:D/


That's cool. I wish I could think that way, but I find that I am almost always in a hurry, why? I don't know... I have to get my act together, but so far jeep has done well taking turns fast and I believe I should stop pushing it. I think the tipover is just a split second event and you never know the threshold of the tires before they finally give and get up the pavement..
 

jgp1843

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The HR rating has nothing to do with dimensions, it's a speed rating for radials in the rest of the world (non P-Metric). The ratings go T, S, H, V, and some others that are really extreme. H means the tires are good for sustained 130 mph.

Sticky tires can make a tall vehicle more prone to rollover - small sedans with stock, mushy suspensions that switch to really sticky "R"-compound race tires for autocross racing have been known to fall over. Just drive the Libby like a 4WD SUV should be driven and you'll be fine. Just don't play Michael Schumacher in the twisties.
 

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you mean so a saturn can do this. as far as the liberty goes drive it like a SUV and your fine. I co drive a turbo neon at the local autocross club and R counds on a FWD can cause this to happen with the right conditions.
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hyde

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I am no pro. :) As far as driving like an SUV is concerned, I don't know how not to drive like an SUV because I never drove sedan for long time. I have been driving my KJ the same way since I got it, but I realize that once I do something with it, I push it, like you mentioned switching lanes fast 60mph+ to squeeze in some space or taking corner from 0 to 30 stuff like that.. and I am completely aware of it and it doesn't feel like it will tip over, but again like I mentioned above.. all it probably takes is a split second before it rolls over.
Anyway, thanks for the comments on this, and I guess I am not lifting my KJ anytime soon with the way I am driving it.. #-o

There was a video of Toyota or Mitsubishi in the desert, dude was driving it in two wheels like that saturn, and even taking turns.. wild stuff
 

jgp1843

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Yep, and those vehicles were heavily modified. Here where I live in Colorado, several of the manufacturers bring new vehicles to film commercials in spectacular terrain. What the commercials don't show is that most of the vehicles used in the filming are hauled off, first by wreckers onto flatbeds, then by flatbed to the boneyard. They usually destroy several trucks in the filming of a single commercial, usually on trails that are easily traveled in a stock SUV when driven correctly. We locals chuckle when we see them show up for filming. Those commercials really teach people how NOT to drive in the boonies.

The right way to drive a truck, or most any SUV off-highway is generally slowly in a very low gear. If you want to go fast, buy a Subaru STi or Mitsu EVO, add about $80,000 (that's what it takes in the US, WRC is $1 million plus) and go rallying.

On the street, SUVs are not sports cars. They are perfectly safe and practical when driven normally. If driven hard, or with sudden steering inputs, you can get in trouble. It's all about driver responsibility.

RE the Saturn: Yep, I've seen a couple of those situations, always a serious driver error. I currently race a CSP MR2 and have codriven US stage rallies - but I use low range a lot in the mountains with my 4WDs. Different tools for different jobs.
 

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