CRD engine rattling

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
I’ve mentioned this before in previous posts, but my 05 CRD has developed a bad rattling noise. It’s gotten drastically worse over the weekend and after inspecting it today it sounds like it’s either the oil pump or the fuel pump. Since I’m still getting oil pressure and my engine hasn’t blown up, I think my cp3 is dying. From all of the symptoms that I’ve read about it send to match well. Any idea on how to prove/test this?
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
Sadly it's a cam belt off job to check it, however if it is the CP3 or something else that the cam belt spins then you are risking a catastrophic failure. Also if the high pressure pump is coming to bits it will destroy the injectors too, however given the very close tolerances and pressure that the pump runs at I'd be surprised if the engine would run if the pump was bad enough to be that noisy.
If its front of engine then hopefully it's a pully bearing or water pump making the noise, but I wouldn't want to drive it until I'd found out what was wrong, a failure could be very expensive, do you have a mechanics stethoscope? Might help narrow down the noise.
Did it start making the noise after you did the cam belt? Maybe a faulty new part?? The top end is still suspect too, a metallic noise like you described could easily be a rocker.

Sorry about the multiple edits, I'm on a course today so I only get short breaks.
 
Last edited:

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
Noise started before I worked on it and I replaced all of the pulleys and the water pump. I have used a stethoscope extensively and I can’t hear the noise coming from the valve train. I took the oil filler cap off and I can’t hear any difference. It’s coming from much lower down in the engine. Also the hard starting, excess smoking, surging at idle, air-fuel ratio codes, and awful fuel mileage all seem to be consistent with a failing cp3 pump. It wasn’t too bad when I first heard it but it’s gotten worse. I’m thinking that the pump could have broken one of the internal springs and that’s causing it to rattle. As it rattles it only gets worse; since there’s three valves in the pump the other two could be getting the engine by especially since I added a lift pump.
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
Possably, i believe the CP3 is fitted several other makes so a replacement shouldn't be too hard to find and a diesel shop should be able to test your original. As I said earlier, I definitely wouldn't drive it as it stands, if it is the pump it can easily destroy all the injectors and contaminate the fuel system.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
Unfortunately it’s my daily driver and I don’t have any alternatives. I’m catching rides as much as I can but it’s still being driven some. Any idea if I give it a dose of marvel mystery oil if that might help. Maybe at least quiet it down a bit? I’ve used it before on different engines with good success, maybe a dose in the fuel might help?
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
I doubt it would do anything, equally it shouldn't hurt it though.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
New theory: sticky valves or failing valve springs. I had a buddy listen to it and he was surprised that the engine was still running for the amount of noise it was making. He suggested that a valve sticking open could explain the symptoms and and the clattering noise; I think that a failing valve spring or loose valve guide could also produce the same results. Anybody have any experience or info pertaining to this?
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
I think we talked about this originally, they are known to wear the rocker gear, unfortunately it's fiddly job to pull the rocker box off to investigate but it's the most likely source of the noise. Hopefully that's all it is though, easier than pulling the head for a valve issue.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
So if a rocker wore it could rattle and make noise without necessarily failing?
I can't hear it in the valve cover though, it seems deeper in the engine.
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
Potentially yes, also its a 16 valve engine so the loss of one won't entirely disable one cylinder. The fact it sounds deeper in the engine isn't good though, unfortunately without starting to strip down its all guesswork.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
Well…
Not guesswork anymore. Something blew in my engine on my way home at 11 PM. Not sure what but I think it’s finally time to find my rattle. And probably rebuild my engine…
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
Something popped and I started blowing thick white smoke from the exhaust. I pulled over right away and shut it off, so it was running for less than a minute. As I stopped, I got a low coolant light. Under the hood there are no obvious leaks or issues but the coolant reservoir is empty. The oil smells funny, but it’s not necessarily a milkshake. I removed a fuse so that I could crank it without it firing, and it doesn’t sound like anything metal is rattling around but it was wheezing and galloping. I only turned it over for a couple of seconds and immediately left it alone. Now I’m waiting for a tow truck to come and get it. Anybody wanna wager what happened?
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
I'm guessing something has knocked a hole in a liner to loose coolant that quickly.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
I kinda knew this day (or night) was coming, I just really hoped that it wasn’t going to. I’ll be tearing into it on Monday after college classes. Hopefully it makes for a project that is as exciting as I always imagined it would be ‍♂️
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
I pushed it up to my garage today. No leaking of any kind, but the oil is significantly over full and it smells funny. I’m guessing the oil is full of coolant. Anybody have an oil laboratory that you’d recommend for examining an oil sample? I’ve heard of different places that do it but I’ve never tried before.
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
It often sits in the bottom of the sump, pull the plug and you will probably find it under the oil, if it's mixed with the oil it will be a white emulsion.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
Well I have my update. I decided to start teardown last night and I kept at it till 2 AM. I made it all the way until I started to round over a head bolt so I stopped for the night. I stopped by harbor freight tools today after classes, and I got a set of sockets for removing rounded over bolts. I removed the head and I now have my answers. Last night I was feeling pretty good: my mystery rattle was the harmonic balancer, which had completely separated from the crank pulley; and all of the rockers were in place and functioning. I found my noise and confirmed my feeling that the rockers were still ok. But that didn't account for the breakdown, so I had to keep digging. When I pulled the head, I found one of the exhaust valves on cylinder 2 had broken off and fallen into the combustion chamber. The head of the valve was pressed into the engine head by the cylinder. The cylinder seems ok with only a minor impression and it still moves freely in the block with no problems or abnormalities, but the head is damaged pretty badly. I'll upload some pictures in the next post; can I get the head repaired or is it a necessary replacement? How about the piston? Is it ok or do I need to replace it too?
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
 

KJowner

Full Access Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2022
Messages
901
Reaction score
530
Location
Uk
You need to check the head and block to see where the coolant went, the impact may have popped the head gasket and distorted the head and / lifted the liner, cracked the liner etc, check the head to see how flat it is + get it pressure tested to see if its cracked. I'd also be concerned that it may have bent the conrod that's a substantial impact.
The head is probably salvageable but the guide and valve seat will need inspecting and probably rework.
The piston is a bit ugly, a lot of material has been displaced from the look of the picture and very little of it has bulged into the bowl as far as I can see.
Hard one to call with the cost of parts vs age of car, any second hand dead engines about you can scavenge bits from?
Oh and be careful rotating it with the head off, it's a wet liner engine and they can pop loose if you turn it without clamping them, if they come loose you should pull them out and replace the seals, the usual trick is to clamp them with flatbar bolted on where the head bolts go so you can spin the engine with any more headaches.
 

Btownpreacher

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2022
Messages
122
Reaction score
101
I think the head is probably not worth it. I would need to replace all of the valves and hardware as well as get it machined and the new valves set. It looks like the aluminum is pressed into the other exhaust valve and there’s slight warping where the valve pressed into the head. I haven’t checked the price from a local machine shop, but I can order a brand new head pre assembled. I think the piston is fine; it looks bad but it moves freely and there’s no cracking in the piston. Also the depression on the piston looks pretty minor, most of the valve sat in the combustion chamber. The liner and block look good tho, the gasket is shot. It leaked coolant into the cylinder and oil. I’m cleaning it all right now and preparing to order parts.
 

Latest posts

Members online

Top