Cold Air Comming in by passenger

[lbeothuckl]

Hi guys,
I was wondering if anyone has heard of this. Last night on a long drive (highway) in the cold the wife was complaining that her feet were freezing. I put the air on the floor but she said it did nothing. I got her to drive and sure enough there is a huge cold draft down there. It seems like the cold air is blowing in from behind the lower dash. It was actually pretty bad (was a cold night -6).
Anyone heard of this?

 

[LibertyTC]

Lack of Insulation

What year Liberty Do you have? Is it just the passenger side?
If it is under warranty take it back to dealer and let em look at it. Could be a seal problem somewhere.
In my KJ,wait until it's -18 insulated boots recommended.
Some have gone as far as adding felt hair padding in doors, floors etc.
I have just ordered WeatherTech Liners hoping that would help a bit.
US site: http://www.weathertech.com/store/mvproduct.aspx?ItemGroupId=52&VehId=709&Year=2004&CustomerVehId=0
May consider a small wool blanket/towel to throw over passenger feet.
Hope this helps a bit for now...

 

[lbeothuckl]

Its an 03, so only powertrain left and its just the passenger side. Seems to be coming in right behind the glovebox. I will probally have thow a blanket in there for the time being. thanks for the help. I'm gonna pull the dash apart I think as it was really uncomfterable over there.
Also anyone know what this hose is? It goes through the firewall, I was looking around and this is about where the cold air is coming from. I assume it feeds air into the heater. Could this area be the cause?

 

[JeepJeepster]

That is the drain hose for the A/C. Typically it would have water coming out of it given the A/C is running.

I assume you had the heat on the floor position when this was happening? Was heat coming out of the vents and cold air was coming from an unknown place? Not sure where that much cold air could be coming from in that area. check to make sure HOT air is coming out of the floor vents and cold air isnt coming out while all the other vents have hot air coming out.

 

[lbeothuckl]

Yup the heat was on the floor and there was hot air coming out of the vent. It seemed like the whole back of the dash was freezing and sending cold air everywhere. It was super cooled air.
Would it be possible for cold air to be forced up (at highway speeds) that hose and coming into the passenger compartment?

 

[LibertyTC]

Cold Feet...

I had a look at that hose. I know it drains water from AC/ but it may be possible that the cold air is coming though the hose. It is pointed downward and at highway speed the air may be rushing through there. I would take some electrical tape, tape it up temporarily, and go back onto freeway and see if it makes a difference. I am real curious now. My floors are always cold in KJ.
The reality is that at -6 the windchill is more like -15 and if you start the vehicle with a completely cold interior, it takes forever to heat the KJ up inside. Then add to that poor insulation below carpet, with a breeze that comes through the firewall metal, and it's always cold at the floor.
I use a 120 volt electric GM Car Warmer an hour before use and place it on the passenger floor area 1st.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3072/2823188743_79c655a777.jpg?v=0
Consider also a thick 18x27 carpet floor sample. Then you can cut it and get it bound. Makes a huge difference.

 

[lbeothuckl]

I'm going to try that tomorrow. I had it in the garage and peeled back all the molding under the dash. I couldn't see anything besides that hose that would let that much air in. My wife said that she had always found it cold in there, but she is always cold. Thats a F******G proper heater, I remember my dad had one of those.
I'll let you know if it makes any difference, I think I may put a piece of cork in there.
Thanks for the help

 

[boebr1]

There was a tech article I once read in a 4x4 magazine. I tried it out in my old 1974 CJ-5 with a soft top. I will mention what the article did, and then I will mention what i think would be better.

In the article, They had a Jeep wrangler, pulled out the carpet, cleaned the floor, taped over all the drain holes. next they taped down 3 layers of aluminum foil (to reflect heat back at the ground in the summer, and reflect heat back into the cab in the winter). over this, they laid out a layer of jute waffle household style carpet under padding for more insulation and sound deadening. then they installed their new carpet set over this. I tried this, made my own carpet set out of household cut pile carpet. it actually made my cj tolerable in the winter, until i got on the freeway (different story there). It also kept my hands from blistering if i touched the floor in the summer.
There is a foil covered insulation you can buy through several automotive sources, that would work much better i think. you cut these pieces to fit, glue it in, and then you apply a foil tape to seal the seams between pieces, and around the edges of the pieces to seal out water and dirt from getting underneath it. This product used to be very popular inside full size cargo vans. it is very reflective, and insulated. This is probably what I will use if I start noticing it being too horribly cold in the winter. Also as a plus, this will help your sound system sound nicer. i don't know if it is as effective as accusta-mat for noise though

 

[JeepJeepster]

I dont really think that little tube could let any cold air in but its worth a shot. If you forget to take that plug out you'll have a wet floor next summer!

If it were me I would probably take the seat out so I could lay down and get someone to drive while I found where the air was coming from. Not saying you should do that since its not safe but I would do it.

 

[valvestem]

Isn't there a piece of molded foam inside the fender that is supposed to stop air penetration. If you open either door and look into the inside of the fender there should be a piece of black molded foam in there, I think this was developed for your issue, check if it's there.

 

[jnaut]

Yeah, I don't think you're going to have any luck taping up the condensation drain tube. If that were a problem, we'd all have this issue. No, you may have a blend door issue where heat is not properly being directed to the feet, and instead, outside vendet air is coming in.

What you need to do is sit in your driveway, let the engine warm up, and try all the non-defrost settings with full high-temp turned up. You should feel warm air coming out of the floor, then the foor and the upper vents, then the upper vents alone. (all three settings). If you don't feel hot air while standing still on the passenger side, then it's an issue that truly needs repair. If you only feel the cold air at your feet on the passenger side when at speed, there may be a hose that became disconnected and is letting outside air in, but only when at speed.

Again, to keep possible confusion out of the issue, do not use any of the defrost settings, even with the temperature on hot, because the compressor runs in these modes (many people don't realize this).

 

[lbeothuckl]

The foam there between the fender, looks like its in good shape.
I tried all three setting and they all put out warm air.
I took it out for a test drive with the wife in the passenger seat. First I tried it with no hot air and her side cold down and cold air was coming from behind the glove box. The heat works fine. that cold air is really hitting in behind what is the blower motor (I assume anyway, whatever that rig is when you lower the glove box).
I tried putting 3 lights in there, turned the lights off in the garage. I was hoping to see the light escaping but could not.
Oh and I taped the hose, didn't seem to do anything
Would it be a bad idea to put insulation in that area?

 

[Corwyyn]

Yes the blower motor is located behind the glove box. You might check to see if the knockout they use for the clutch cable on the RHD models has come out - check this page on the firewall penetrations and look at the pic for the passenger side, it'll give you an idea of where to look and what you're looking for.

Again, to keep possible confusion out of the issue, do not use any of the defrost settings, even with the temperature on hot, because the compressor runs in these modes (many people don't realize this).

While the compressor does come on in the defrost settings if he has the temp control up to max heat it shouldn't make a difference. The main reason the compressor comes on is to help dry the air so the windows un-fog faster (or to keep them from fogging).

 

[jnaut]

While the compressor does come on in the defrost settings if he has the temp control up to max heat it shouldn't make a difference. The main reason the compressor comes on is to help dry the air so the windows un-fog faster (or to keep them from fogging).

I totally agree and understand. But the engineer inside me tends to shy away from adding any variables to a situation. After reading his problem, I really felt that he should perform his tests with hot, unconditioned air.

 

[lil black liberty]

Have you checked all of your firewall? I know when I had a cold air leak it was from when the stereo shop boys ran a cable and didn't re seal the hole, A little Silicone fixed that problem!

 

[Ry' N Jen]

Our 2004 does not have this problem!
The heater in our KJ is so bloody hot in the winter...
I went out this past weekend and had a look at the heater Assembly and the only thing I could come up with is:
1. One of the vacuum operated heater/vent control's is mal-functioning- staying open and drawing cold air in from outside.(As already mentioned here)
2. There is a crack at worst in the heater itself. Or there is a gap between the heater and the sheet metal it is mounted too.
Just short of taking everything apart(I would if this was happening to our truck, as I need the heat at 100% at the foot well due to medical reasons, so, for me I would be in there like a dirty shirt!) That would really be the only way to know for sure.
I'm sure that if you took it into a dealership they would suggest the same thing.
I have a feeling that one of the vacuum hoses may have split or come off of one of the internal blend valves.

 

[lbeothuckl]

I haven't had a chance to check the firewall completely, but will be pulling this dam thing apart next weekend. I think its a similar situation to lil black, well hopefully anyway.
I would have thought that if the vacuum operated vent control's were malfunctioning and drawing cold air in from outside then there would be cold air coming from the vents. The heater is pushing tons of warm air. In that area its cold enough, with the cold air coming in, that the passenger is uncomfortable (around the knee area).
I friggin hope its not the second option.
I would actually bring this to a dealership but I have no trust in them. As there is only powertrain left on the Jeep I don't go near that place. Just talking about those dealerships ****** me off.
But thanks for the ideas guys. I'll post more as I get the time to actually gupp thuis baby apart.

 

[lil black liberty]

Most definitely check that firewall.. I hated having cold air being forced in going down the highway it sucked majorly.. after I realized duh it wasn't doing it before the subwoofer install, that it must have something to do with that. Sure enough checked where the wire came in through the firewall and I could see light in and out of that hole.. I was like hmm easy enough.. Went and got the old silicone gun and put some on the inside and outside of that hole.. No more leaks.. Let us know though what was the problem..

 

[lil black liberty]

Any Updates on this??

 

[lbeothuckl]

Sorry haven't had a chance, been up to my ears with work. I think maybe this weekend. I'll post some pics and the results as soon as I get on it.
Friggin work, keeping me for my Jeep