2002 Jeep Cherokee/Liberty Radio Head Unit Problem

2002_KJ

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I have the Infinity Sound System in my 2002 Jeep Cherokee/Liberty (European export) with radio/CD/cassette/rear CD changer. Recently I've noticed the radio and display do not turn on right away either with the key to acc. with the ignition turned before starting the engine, or the engine running; it usually takes anywhere from 3 to 10 minutes for the radio/display to turn on and sometimes it seems it will turn on faster if I start flipping through switches either on the radio or on the control stalk like headlamp, dash light dimmer, etc.

I can hear a clicking noise behind the steering wheel, (almost like a relay switch,) when I press the radio power button on, but the display stays off and the radio doesn't work. Interestingly, with the steering wheel controls I can switch to the rear CD player/changer input and that will start playing music and I can even change the volume with the power **** on the head unit, adjust fade/balance, etc. but again, nothing on the display turns on and the radio doesn't work.

When the radio/display does finally turn on I can start tuning to different stations and it will generally stay on when the car is running. However, sometimes if I use the seek button a lot, for example, it will turn back off randomly and it's possible this happens more while the engine isn't running (with the key to acc. or turned before starting) or maybe it just turns back off because the buttons are pushed too much like seek, etc.

Took off the trim panel and disconnected the radio from its two connections and antenna plug then reconnected to see if that would do something, also just to check the connections and state of the radio (without actually opening the unit), and I can't seem to see anything suspicious (again, I did not actually open the radio and look at circuit boards etc.)

I took a look at the side fuse box comparing it to this fuse box diagram and noticed that some fuses are the incorrect amperage, and some sockets that should have fuses are empty, and some sockets that should be empty according to the diagram have fuses in them. For example, the #21 "Radio, Body Control Module, Left/Right Door Lock Switch" that uses a 10 amp fuse, has no fuse actually in it. The #20, which on the diagram shows as empty, on mine has a 20 amp fuse, and the #22 "Power Sunroof Relay, Antenna Module" which should have a 20 amp fuse has a 10 amp fuse on mine, the #23 slot is empty on the diagram but has a 10 amp fuse on mine. I'm assuming that the fuse box diagram I'm using is correct, but perhaps I'm missing something with how fuses work, and maybe the fuses don't even have anything to do with my original problem.

Some other ideas I had: could there be something wrong witch a capacitor etc. in the radio itself? Maybe a problem with the antenna? A wiring issue or resistance somewhere?

Any help would be really appreciated. I would rather keep this radio and try to fix it or replace it with another used OEM that doesn't cost too much, rather than installing a new radio, if that's at all possible. Thank you.


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2002_KJ

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Hello & welcome
My personal opinion on your radio issues will be found internally of the radio and not the fuses.

Regards
FishermanAllen
Thank you. In any case, do you think I should correct the fuses to match the diagram?
 

Billwill

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I have the same Radio/Tape deck in my Export 2002 CRD but do not have the rear CD player/shuttle.

If you lose power to the Radio you have to enter a 4 digit code to get it to work again...hopefully you have that code written down somewhere in your manuals!:oops:

I believe there may be a fuse actually inside the radio itself!
 
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2002_KJ

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I have the same Radio/Tape deck in my Export 2002 CRD but do not have the rear CD player/shuttle.

If you lose power to the Radio you have to enter a 4 digit code to get it to work again...hopefully you have that code written down somewhere in your manuals!:oops:

I believe there may be a fuse actually inside the radio itself!
Yes, thankfully I do have the code. I imagine the fuses are probably not the issue since obviously they’re either blown or not…but stranger things have happened.

Certainly don’t like the dash fuses all mixed up as they are, but maybe that’s not as big a deal as I think…I’m almost a little worried something will go wrong by correcting them, it wouldn’t surprise me.
 

Billwill

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There is always a possibility that a previous owner has messed around with the original wiring for some reason or other. I have never seen a Relay behind the steering wheel that could be clicking...you need to check if that looks original or added on.
My Export Diesel is coming up for 20 years in my possession now and I vaguely remember in the beginning on LOST that there was some issue Users had with the Fuse inside the radio.
Go through the Wiring diagrams...making sure that you do not get confused between the CRDs and the V6 and try find the "clicking" object in front of the steering wheel.
The "Multifunction Switch" which is the switch that controls Turn signals, wipers etc. has a reputation for failing so a previous owner may have modified the wiring to bypass the Multifunction Switch. If you have Radio Controls on the Steering wheel then a failing Clockspring could cause problems...be careful working around the steering wheel with battery connected as you could set off the Airbags with disastrous results!
The Radio should come ON when the ignition is in the ACC position...the Ignition Switch Actuator may be failing...fairly common on older Jeeps. You can remove the plastic covers over the steering wheel, remove the one Allen S*c*r*e*w* holding the Ignition Switch itself to the Actuator Pin assembly. Then you can switch the Ignition Switch to the different positions with a small flat screwdriver while the Key is sitting in the Ignition slot to enable the SKEES security.
 
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2002_KJ

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Well, looks like I was wrong about the fuses being incorrectly placed. The diagram I was referencing from the link in my first post, (even though it says for Jeep KJ 2002-2007) doesn't seem to match the diagram from the service manual for the 2002 KJ, which shows mine are all correct. So there's that...good lesson for me.
 

doyle5914

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Hey, did you ever figure out what was causing the problem with your radio? Mine does the same thing.

I have the single CD/tape version of the factory radio in my 02 Limited, and don't have an external changer.

My radio display doesn't come on when I first turn the key to either ACC or RUN, but after a while (usually a few minutes) it will spontaneously come to life.

I'm thinking maybe some of 20-year-old caps in the radio need replacing.

Incidentally I have another factory radio that is similar in function but a slightly different Mopar P/N, and it behaves the same way. I also have a '00 WJ with the factory radio and have never had a problem like this one, even though it's older.
 
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2002_KJ

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Hey, did you ever figure out what was causing the problem with your radio? Mine does the same thing.

I have the single CD/tape version of the factory radio in my 02 Limited, and don't have an external changer.

My radio display doesn't come on when I first turn the key to either ACC or RUN, but after a while (usually a few minutes) it will spontaneously come to life.

I'm thinking maybe some of 20-year-old caps in the radio need replacing.

Incidentally I have another factory radio that is similar in function but a slightly different Mopar P/N, and it behaves the same way. I also have a '00 WJ with the factory radio and have never had a problem like this one, even though it's older.
Hey, no I never figured it out. But if you tried with another head unit and it does the same thing in that car my assumption is that it doesn’t bode well in terms of replacing or repairing the head unit itself to fix the issue? What do you think?

If its not the head unit itself then I wonder if its something to do with the wiring or whatever relay/switch that leads to the radio. Do your speakers work OK? Maybe corrosion somewhere causing resistance? I wish I knew but for now I’ve kind of given up.

I was going to try another head unit myself, same exact functions but a different part number, but if you say you’ve tried that and it still doesn’t work then I don’t even know if I should try...wish I knew.
 

doyle5914

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Hey, no I never figured it out. But if you tried with another head unit and it does the same thing in that car my assumption is that it doesn’t bode well in terms of replacing or repairing the head unit itself to fix the issue? What do you think?

If its not the head unit itself then I wonder if its something to do with the wiring or whatever relay/switch that leads to the radio. Do your speakers work OK? Maybe corrosion somewhere causing resistance? I wish I knew but for now I’ve kind of given up.

I was going to try another head unit myself, same exact functions but a different part number, but if you say you’ve tried that and it still doesn’t work then I don’t even know if I should try...wish I knew.
I agree it's unlikely to be something internal to the radio, since both units I have behave the same way.

I recently replaced the ignition switch and actuator assembly with brand new parts, thinking maybe the contacts inside the switch had gotten a bit flaky over time, since the Jeep has 185,000 miles. But that didn't matter either. I even tried operating the switch independently of the actuator in all positions using a screwdriver while I had the assembly apart. No difference. Well at least that's now good for another 185k. :)

One interesting observation I've made is that when the radio k_n_o_b is in the out (on) position and I turn the key to ACC or RUN, the speakers make a "pop" sound, but no display.

When I first bought this Jeep it had an aftermarket Pioneer stereo in it, which didn't work at all -- the 10A fuse on the back of the stereo was blown. Fortunately it had been installed using a plug-in adapter to the factory harness, so as far as I've been able to tell, there have been no wires cut or spliced into the stock wiring.

There is one electrical mod that I've seen under the hood, a red wire (presumably connected to constant +12V) that runs along the frame and up into the rear right quarter panel where a Hoppy trailer wiring controller has been installed inside. That all looks proper as far as I can tell.
 
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2002_KJ

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Try adding a good ground onto the metal casing of the Radio...finding bad grounds on electrical equipment during my working career enabled me to retire early at 55! ;)

Will not do any harm!
I wonder if you could maybe describe a little more how I could try doing this? Thanks.
 

doyle5914

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Since this was a long weekend, I decided to do more troubleshooting on this problem, taking to heart Bill's suggestion regarding grounding. With this in mind, I pored through the '02 KJ service manual to find out all I could about wire colors on the radio connector, ground and splice locations, the Standard and Premium versions of radios, etc.

I ran a long jumper wire from the ground strap on the engine into the cabin & clipped it tight on the case of the radio. Problem still happened. I also removed the console and the knee blocker to inspect the wiring harness and look for any signs of modification. No foul play seemed to be evident.

Next, I made a couple of back probes and plugged them into the various power, ground, and illumination circuits in the 22 pin connector, and noted voltage readings from the battery, ignition switch and lighting. These signals all looked proper.

So, now I'm really scratching my head. This is turning out to quite a round of Stump the Chump!

One other observation I've made is that any condition where the display would be at full brightness seems to affect the radio badly. An example is setting my dimmer switch to "Parade" mode, another is turning my headlight switch off from the Parking Lights position. When I do either one of these things, the whole radio goes off (including the display) and I hear a "pop" from the speakers.

So, a couple of possibilities that I haven't fully "run to ground" so to speak:

1) The display circuit inside the radio could have a fault, maybe a dried-out capacitor or a blown transistor. I can fix problems like this, but it would be nice to have a schematic to work from, and I have no idea how to get one. Otherwise I can certainly start poking around the board
2) It's possible I might just have incompatible radios for the Infinity system in the Jeep without realizing it .. The two radios I've tried are P/N P56038586AG, and P05091606AD.

Can anyone shed more light on either of these two possibilities? Thanks!
 

2002_KJ

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Since this was a long weekend, I decided to do more troubleshooting on this problem, taking to heart Bill's suggestion regarding grounding. With this in mind, I pored through the '02 KJ service manual to find out all I could about wire colors on the radio connector, ground and splice locations, the Standard and Premium versions of radios, etc.

I ran a long jumper wire from the ground strap on the engine into the cabin & clipped it tight on the case of the radio. Problem still happened. I also removed the console and the knee blocker to inspect the wiring harness and look for any signs of modification. No foul play seemed to be evident.

Next, I made a couple of back probes and plugged them into the various power, ground, and illumination circuits in the 22 pin connector, and noted voltage readings from the battery, ignition switch and lighting. These signals all looked proper.

So, now I'm really scratching my head. This is turning out to quite a round of Stump the Chump!

One other observation I've made is that any condition where the display would be at full brightness seems to affect the radio badly. An example is setting my dimmer switch to "Parade" mode, another is turning my headlight switch off from the Parking Lights position. When I do either one of these things, the whole radio goes off (including the display) and I hear a "pop" from the speakers.

So, a couple of possibilities that I haven't fully "run to ground" so to speak:

1) The display circuit inside the radio could have a fault, maybe a dried-out capacitor or a blown transistor. I can fix problems like this, but it would be nice to have a schematic to work from, and I have no idea how to get one. Otherwise I can certainly start poking around the board
2) It's possible I might just have incompatible radios for the Infinity system in the Jeep without realizing it .. The two radios I've tried are P/N P56038586AG, and P05091606AD.

Can anyone shed more light on either of these two possibilities? Thanks!
Interesting diagnostics report I’d say! One thing I’ve noticed for my problem is that now that it’s hot/warm out, the radio turns on almost immediately most of the time; wondering what that means.

I’ve also had intermittent airbag dash light issues even after replacing the airbag module this winter under the old recall from 2015. The airbag light will come on sometimes when I turn the car on, sometimes it doesn’t, sometimes it turns on then off after a bit while driving, I was also wondering if these electrical problems could be related…maybe something to do with the clockspring? I thought I read that the clockspring also has something to do with the radio maybe through the wheel controls or something. Just throwing out ideas at this point.
 

doyle5914

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Thanks for the additional info!

- The radio turning on quicker as ambient temp increases might point to a failing solder connection internal to the radio. I just disassembled one of mine (the P05091606AD unit) and am now hunting for the components related to the display. Also, I've identified a few companies that either repair or sell refurbed radios, but it looks like a couple hundred bucks to go that route. So I'll keep poking for a while longer. Would be great if anyone on the forum knows where those components are located on the board or might have a bootleg schematic.

- Curious if you're seeing the same behavior where the radio will turn off when your Jeep's instrument panel lights are on and then you set the dimmer to Parade mode. Mine will also turn off if my panel lights on and then I turn them off. It seems that any control inputs that would cause the display to immediately go to full brightness will kill the radio. Except for the ignition switch turn from OFF to either RUN or ACC, in which case it comes on slowly, usually after 15 seconds or so. But when it does, it appears to be full brightness.

- A failing clockspring is an interesting hypothesis. The steering wheel radio button signals run through the clockspring and present a variable voltage to the BCM in their various states of press and release. The BCM then translates that input voltage into commands that are sent to the radio through the PCI connection. I have also encountered intermittent airbag indications on the panel. However, I think mine were caused by removing the front seats to do some deep cleaning. Once I reinstalled the front seats, reconnected the plugs underneath, and cleared the airbag codes, that issue hasn't returned. But I will keep an eye out for it, now that you've mentioned it.
 
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2002_KJ

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Thanks for the additional info!

- The radio turning on quicker as ambient temp increases might point to a failing solder connection internal to the radio. I just disassembled one of mine (the P05091606AD unit) and am now hunting for the components related to the display. Also, I've identified a few companies that either repair or sell refurbed radios, but it looks like a couple hundred bucks to go that route. So I'll keep poking for a while longer. Would be great if anyone on the forum knows where those components are located on the board or might have a bootleg schematic.

- Curious if you're seeing the same behavior where the radio will turn off when your Jeep's instrument panel lights are on and then you set the dimmer to Parade mode. Mine will also turn off if my panel lights on and then I turn them off. It seems that any control inputs that would cause the display to immediately go to full brightness will kill the radio. Except for the ignition switch turn from OFF to either RUN or ACC, in which case it comes on slowly, usually after 15 seconds or so. But when it does, it appears to be full brightness.

- A failing clockspring is an interesting hypothesis. The steering wheel radio button signals run through the clockspring and present a variable voltage to the BCM in their various states of press and release. The BCM then translates that input voltage into commands that are sent to the radio through the PCI connection. I have also encountered intermittent airbag indications on the panel. However, I think mine were caused by removing the front seats to do some deep cleaning. Once I reinstalled the front seats, reconnected the plugs underneath, and cleared the airbag codes, that issue hasn't returned. But I will keep an eye out for it, now that you've mentioned it.
My knowledge of radios and their components is non-existent unfortunately! I'll look online and see if I can find some sort of schematic for these radios but I'm sure you've tried already.

Next time around I'll experiment with the dimmer and switches and see what happens, I'll let you know.

I'll check the connections under my seats to see if that fixes the intermittent airbag light. Still, I wouldn't be surprised if the issues between the airbag light and radio are somehow related in terms of wiring or shared components like the clockspring.

BTW, my radio part number is P56038585A0. I've thought about just upgrading the radio and speakers (my speakers also don't work well, the front speakers crackle a lot as well as the smaller speakers on the dash. I set the fade to rear speakers but sometimes the left one will cut out until I mess with the balance and then it comes back.) I get the feeling that replacing the head unit and speakers might not solve the issue if the problem is a deeper-rooted one with shared wiring or the steering controls etc. but that could just be my pessimism.

Definitely wish I were an automotive electronics wizard in these situations :/
 

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