"That's Impossible"

[zzAMBIENzz]

Finally got the Auto Auction KJ tore down yesterday, and as expected, the timing was off ... bad!

The previous owner had done new head gaskets and looks like they installed the timing set starting with #1 on the wrong stroke. Everything was perfect ... perfectly 180 degrees out. The crank pulley at TDC compression was at 12 o'clock, and the cams and dummy pulley were at 6.

New parts are currently on the way to correct the problem. But there is still the one, BIG lingering question:

HOW THE HELL DID IT RUN AT ALL!!!???

To quote my mechanic friend that came by just to put a second set of eyes on it for me "That's Impossible!" But, impossible or not, it did run ... quite well for something that was completely wrong.

So does anyone have any insight as to how, with both cams installed 180 out, one side of the engine would run fine, and one side would be completely dead?

I should also note that I did decide not to pull the heads and do a visual inspection of the valvetrain. I have tested every cylinder for compression and all are good, and after correcting the cam timing, I reinstalled the tensioners "good enough" to rotate the engine by hand, and everything spins smooth and free. I really hope I don't regret cutting this corner, but it saves nearly $350, and every test indicates the valves are good. I can only assume that since it was timed exactly 180 out, this allowed the valves to still open in time with the pistons, just the wrong valves were opening.

 

[sota]

lingering gasses, cross cylinder air/fuel charge draw, get enough build up and once it's sucked into the engine and hit with a spark it'll ignite.

 

[tommudd]

Strange things can happen inside there
15-16 years ago bought a 49 Ford with a flathead in it
It had sat for years inside of an old heated garage under a house
Guy bought it and rebuilt/ went through the motor/ transmission etc making it a good driver
Put it all together and it would idle good, run down the road on level had a slight miss, but no power on any hill etc
Finally called me said he was giving up, his wife was mad he'd spent so much and didn't run right and he had to sell
Brought it home and he had the plugs wires like a small block Ford ( I think thats what I figured out)
Changed them to correct firing order and running good 20 minutes later.
Should of kept that one, but hey when you can make $6500.00 in two days bye bye
:gr_grin:

 

[Conundrum2006]

"That's Impossible"

Probably pure happenstance that engine ran at all. The cam timing is that sensor on the drivers side head near the front. I forget how the firing order goes but every so many seconds another piston hits TDC and 1-6-5-4-3-2 , only running on 1-5-3 probably because it’s exactly 180 degrees off. Or maybe only the drivers timing was off.

Ps I don’t think The cam sensor would be fooled, it’s just reading where the drivers use cam is with absolute certainty, translating that to the pcm that’s reading the crank with certainty and figuring out where 1-3-5 are. Just a guess


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[zzAMBIENzz]

lingering gasses, cross cylinder air/fuel charge draw, get enough build up and once it's sucked into the engine and hit with a spark it'll ignite.

I don't mean it started and chugged a little ... I mean it ran and drove. Actually drove it from the auction to my shop! Don't get me wrong, it ran like crap, (what you would expect for a V-6 on 3 cylinders).

I will definitely be interested to see how it runs when the new parts get here tomorrow. Really hoping that I don't regret not pulling the heads and visually inspecting the valvetrain.

 

[tommudd]

Auction....
Head work........
First thing I would of done was made sure the heads were done and done right
But thats me, hate doing things over

 

[zzAMBIENzz]

Auction....
Head work........
First thing I would of done was made sure the heads were done and done right
But thats me, hate doing things over

If this vehicle were for me, I would have started over from scratch. I bought this one to flip, AND I try really ******* my flips to keep the selling price as low as possible. I do these more for enjoyment than for profit, and my ultimate goal is to try to give people that don't have a lot of cash access to better quality cars than some of the junk you see being sold on Marketplace and Craigslist. My goal is to have this for sale for $2000 or less and hopefully make a couple hundred bucks to put towards the next one.

I know that kinda sounds counterintuitive ... I want "good quality", but I didn't check the head work ... and it kinda is. BUT, I will do an extensive leak down test after its reassembled, and if anything looks bad, it will come apart. My HOPE at this point is that everything was done right. I can tell from just visually looking at the heads they were rebuilt. (everything is clean, lifters are clearly new, springs look new, ect). Preliminary basic compression test seemed good (for an engine that was out of time).

Just about to head to the other shop and start putting it together now, so I should have good news or bad news by this time tomorrow.