Abs...

[honu]

Just recently, I was out, driving with my newly licensed daughter. She mentioned that during her driving lessons, there was never any training regarding ABS.

Sooo, I had her drive over to the local college (Sunday afternoon) in order to use the parking lot for a little demonstration.

I wanted to show her that with ABS, she could still steer the vehicle, that hard braking was no longer a "Stomp and Pray" exercise.

I brought the Liberty up to about 50-55 MPH and applied full brakes... Wow, after the smoke cleared and the smell of burnt rubber drifted away, we got out and were impressed by the four, dark, arcing skid marks on the fresh asphalt.

Foolish me, apparently our 2002 Liberty Limited either isn't equipped with ABS, as I assumed it was, or it has malfunctioned without the warning light being activated.

The point of all this is... if ours is not equipped, can it be retrofitted with ABS at a reasonable cost?

 

[TAwesome]

I also drive an 02 limited and my abs works just fine. Try it on a gravel road. That is where mine usually kicks in.

 

[ThunderbirdJunkie]

a LOT of KJs do not have ABS.

It was optional on all trim levels until 2006, when it became standard with traction control and the other crap you don't want.

Nope, can't retrofit.

 

[tjkj2002]

Yep ABS was a $650 option on a KJ till '06 like stated,and no it can not be retrofitted.


Your better off without it anyways.

 

[offrovering]

our 03 does not have it. Whenever I drive it I cannot say I miss it.

 

[offrovering]

look at your master cylinder, if it doesnt lead to an ABS modulator you do not have ABS, simple check.

 

[subflea]

Why would you want to retrofit it?

 

[JeepINgeek]

abs is required now for a reason..

but theyre right. it was an option. now its not.

i have it and love it 99% of the time

 

[honu]

Thanks for the feed back, I know I shouldn't have assumed the vehicle had ABS...

I understand the concept and practice of threshold braking, but I'm sure the driver's training instructors didn't include it in my kid's instruction program.

Looks like a few trips to an empty parking lot for some brake training.

 

[JeepINgeek]

thats always a good idea. even with abs... takes some getting used to.

 

[tjkj2002]

abs is required now for a reason..

but theyre right. it was an option. now its not.

i have it and love it 99% of the time

It's only standard due to ESP being federally mandated,ABS is not federally mandated but must be present for ESP to function.

ABS has been shown(by insurance companies) to cause more accidents then it prevents.

 

[family KJ]

It's only standard due to ESP being federally mandated,ABS is not federally mandated but must be present for ESP to function.

ABS has been shown(by insurance companies) to cause more accidents then it prevents.

Why would that be???

 

[subflea]

Because people overestimate the ability of their brakes with ABS and change their driving habits, taking more risks.

 

[tjkj2002]

Because people overestimate the ability of their brakes with ABS and change their driving habits, taking more risks.

Not really,that is a problem though.

The biggest issue is most do not know what the expect when the ABS actually kicks in during a panic stop,they think the ABS is functioning 100% of the time(which it does not) so expect nothing out of the ordinary,but when that ABS pump kicks in full force and makes that nice sound and the brake pedal goes funky they let off the brakes thinking something is wrong.Then BAM,into a accident they get.

 

[al7fi]

How true! First time I stood on the brakes in my 03, and that sucker started to chatter. I thought sure it was broke. It has taken some getting used to so it can work like it is supposed to. Biggest thing for me with all my Jeeps (74,77,84,03) was knowing I had a chance if I took the ditch and might even be able to drive back out.

 

[Atrus]

Did a huge research paper on this 10 years ago in college.

When ABS was introduced, accidents where a vehicle rear ended another vehicle significantly dipped. Accidents with fixed objects, however, spiked.

Reason? ABS doesn't necessarily shorten braking distances - on most surfaces, it lengthens it. The advantage to ABS is that the vehicle can be manuvered around the hazard. Non-abs vehicles have wheels that'll lock up (obviously) and in the past, people would naturally crank the wheel trying to avoid the stopped vehicle in front of them. The vehicles didn't respond, or responded poorly, and just plowed forward, striking the other vehicle. ABS vehicles respond as the wheels aren't locked up - therefore, people only need to steer a little and the vehicle would actually manuver, however, by force of habit they'd crank the wheel and end up hitting a sign, building, tree, pole, etc.

 

[Marlon_JB2]

Not really,that is a problem though.

The biggest issue is most do not know what the expect when the ABS actually kicks in during a panic stop,they think the ABS is functioning 100% of the time(which it does not) so expect nothing out of the ordinary,but when that ABS pump kicks in full force and makes that nice sound and the brake pedal goes funky they let off the brakes thinking something is wrong.Then BAM,into a accident they get.

I hate ABS as much as the next guy (But for some odd reason like all the other acronyms), but that can't be blamed on the ABS. That's just typical, popular, dumb(censored) driver error. Which is usually there reason for most accidents.

 

[rockymountain]

Did a huge research paper on this 10 years ago in college.

When ABS was introduced, accidents where a vehicle rear ended another vehicle significantly dipped. Accidents with fixed objects, however, spiked.

Reason? ABS doesn't necessarily shorten braking distances - on most surfaces, it lengthens it. The advantage to ABS is that the vehicle can be manuvered around the hazard. Non-abs vehicles have wheels that'll lock up (obviously) and in the past, people would naturally crank the wheel trying to avoid the stopped vehicle in front of them. The vehicles didn't respond, or responded poorly, and just plowed forward, striking the other vehicle. ABS vehicles respond as the wheels aren't locked up - therefore, people only need to steer a little and the vehicle would actually manuver, however, by force of habit they'd crank the wheel and end up hitting a sign, building, tree, pole, etc.

I'm one that can't stand ABS and no matter what I always have to chime in on this. If I need to turn or maneuver around something I let off the brake. I think you MUST go and practice so you know how your vehicle reacts in situations. I'm one to purposely fish tail around a corner so I am in control of it before it surprises me. Find a parking lot and go do some donuts.

to the OP, I think your daughter will be better off without the ABS. if you start sliding let off the brake and put your vehicle where there isn't anything even if it means going up the curb. I was taught in drivers ed to always have an escape route.

 

[honu]

Knowing that her Jeep doesn't have ABS calls for some additional training. Teaching her the concept of threshold braking assures me that she's in control of the car, not just along for the ride.

The important thing is that people who's vehicles are equipped with ABS have to be aware that threshold braking can defeat the system, causing significantly increased braking distances.

Just gotta know how your vehicle is equipped and don't assume, like I did.

 

[LibertyFever]

Just recently, I was out, driving with my newly licensed daughter. She mentioned that during her driving lessons, there was never any training regarding ABS.

Sooo, I had her drive over to the local college (Sunday afternoon) in order to use the parking lot for a little demonstration.

I wanted to show her that with ABS, she could still steer the vehicle, that hard braking was no longer a "Stomp and Pray" exercise.

I brought the Liberty up to about 50-55 MPH and applied full brakes... Wow, after the smoke cleared and the smell of burnt rubber drifted away, we got out and were impressed by the four, dark, arcing skid marks on the fresh asphalt.

Foolish me, apparently our 2002 Liberty Limited either isn't equipped with ABS, as I assumed it was, or it has malfunctioned without the warning light being activated.

The point of all this is... if ours is not equipped, can it be retrofitted with ABS at a reasonable cost?

I can just imagine how you tried to explain to your "newly licensed daughter" that "this wasn't supposed to happen!" At least you now know your brakes work really good.

I was surprised too that my 04 Liberty Sport didn't have ABS. I thought any vehicle with four wheel disc brakes would have it automatically but it's just not so.

You're not the first person to ask that question about adding ABS. It would be an expensive upgrade and would include a new booster, new ABS wheel bearing units and an ABS computer.