lift Q's----upgrade time

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polomaan

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I have an 05 sport kj and was recently off-roading when i got stuck...it was minor and i got out but it pissed me off enough to want to make a few upgrades. everything is stock right now(and it has done damn good so far). i would like to lift it up 2-2.5" and put some bigger tires on the stock rims(stock rims are actually grey renegade rims). what would you guys recommend? of the pics of jeeps on here i checked out i like bennet's setup so maybe something similar... what do you guys have? pos/neg's? i head something about lockers... what exactly are they and what do I need? also, i think skid plates would be good. this is a bunch of stuff and sounds kinda expensive. please give best advice on more inexpensive options without loosing all quality. what are the things i really need? thanks for putting up with my plethera of questions :)
 

fouros

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cheapest form of insurance is getting the MOPAR skid plates at least the

engine , transmission and transfercase ones and the fuel tank later


lifts well that depends , i would reccomend a coil lift but thats because i have one :lol: , you have heaps more choice in the US in Australia we basically have the OLD MAN EMU lift and the Skyjacker lift if we want spacers we have to order from the US,



http://www.youngs.org/kjparts/default.asp?category=22

have a look here it has a pretty comprehensive overview and ideas where the best deals are


Fouros
 

the1jferg

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None of those other things are gonna help your stuck problem as much as a rear locker, and possibly longer shocks in the rear for more flex. You may find thats all you need. Skids are cheap insurance. Tires really don't make that much diff. The expensive KJ lifts really dont give you crap. If you are gonna lift, Get those EMU coil springs and call it a day.

Remember, the best mud tire is a new mud tire. Keep an extra set of off-road tires or keep the mud tires current.
 

Se7enLC

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the1jferg said:
None of those other things are gonna help your stuck problem as much as a rear locker, and possibly longer shocks in the rear for more flex. You may find thats all you need. Skids are cheap insurance. Tires really don't make that much diff. The expensive KJ lifts really dont give you crap. If you are gonna lift, Get those EMU coil springs and call it a day.

Aren't the Old Man Emu coils only a 1.5" lift or so? If you're going to lift, I don't see why you wouldn't want to lift the most you can (2.5-3.5 or so).

Isn't the Old Man Emu lift an expensive lift? ($670 at rocky-road) You can get a Rusty's lift for under $500 and get the full 2.5" of lift.
 

jfortier777

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the1jferg said:
Tires really don't make that much diff.

I disagree
THIS MUCH

Bad tires are just as bad as an open diff. I don't mean like bare or dryrotted tires; I mean non-AT/MT tires.

Both mods are basically requirements. The order in which you do them wont make much difference because both will give you problems.

Ex: Two road tires spinning in mud is just as likely as 1 mud tire spinning in the mud.
 

Mutt

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This is my KJ:

You must be registered for see images


It has a Frankenlift, which gains the most net lift of any of the available lifts..........ground clearance will help keep you from getting stuck.

Tires make a tremendous difference. I'd like to see another KJ with an all terrain tire follow me though some mud. I just don't understand why people lift their Jeep, spend a pile of money on bigger tires and still get a tire that is only marginally better than a car tire off road.

A locker ensures that your axles are locked and both tires turn at the same speed. See, your four wheel drive is effectively a two wheel drive at any given time. If you are going to do any moderately serious wheeling, you'll want at least one locker.

I'm sure my opinion won't be popular..........
 

Brigrat

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You are pretty much dead on, but there are factors that make a locker and mud tires not desireable or necessary for most people, and some who like to go off-road.

1. Most of us spend MOST of our time on the pavement, making and AT a much better choice most of the time

2. Not all offroading is done on mud. Where I live, dirt roads, and sandy beaches are the norm, making AT's a great choice

3. Lockers are fabulous, and I enjoyed having one on my last truck, but found that I NEVER once needed to use it (I had a selectable Auburn ECTED). It was never locked in other than the first time I went to the beach just to try it out.

4. For most users, a locker is never needed, unless you are a very serious off roader, you have no business even putting yourself in a position to need one.
 

jfortier777

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Mutt said:
I'd like to see another KJ with an all terrain tire follow me though some mud.

Bring the ruckus! I'll follow you through anything. drive.gif drive.gif drive.gif drive.gif

But in all fairness, ATs are ATs and MTs are MTs. They are best at what they do. MT for mud and AT for everything. I chose ATs over MTs for the same reason that I chose ATs over Super Swampers. The benefit did not outweigh the terrain isolation(For my specific situation).

If I am that deep in the mud that my ATs can't get me out then I'm just too deep.(until the warranty runs out) laugh.gif
 

Mutt

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Brigrat said:
You are pretty much dead on, but there are factors that make a locker and mud tires not desireable or necessary for most people, and some who like to go off-road.

1. Most of us spend MOST of our time on the pavement, making and AT a much better choice most of the time

2. Not all offroading is done on mud. Where I live, dirt roads, and sandy beaches are the norm, making AT's a great choice

3. Lockers are fabulous, and I enjoyed having one on my last truck, but found that I NEVER once needed to use it (I had a selectable Auburn ECTED). It was never locked in other than the first time I went to the beach just to try it out.

4. For most users, a locker is never needed, unless you are a very serious off roader, you have no business even putting yourself in a position to need one.

"All Terrain" is very similar to "one size fits all". If you spend the majority of the time on the road and aren't serious about off roading it, why bother lifting it or installing larger tires? I'm sure the girls down at the Sonic aren't impressed with the soccor Mom Liberty anyhoo.

My Claws get great traction in the sand also, I routinely drive down the beach in two wheel drive fully inflated.

Why is it that most rock crawlers run a mud style tire?

Yeah, you'll never need a locker hopping curbs at the Wal-mart.
 

the1jferg

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Don't worry about being unpopular...I don't

Ground clearance on the KJ so far comes from added tire height. A 31 inch tire gives you only 1/2 inch over a 30" tire.

two locked street tires off road far outways 1 mud tire, its about keeping it moving.
 

Mutt

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jfortier777 said:
Mutt said:
I'd like to see another KJ with an all terrain tire follow me though some mud.

Bring the ruckus! I'll follow you through anything. drive.gif drive.gif drive.gif drive.gif

But in all fairness, ATs are ATs and MTs are MTs. They are best at what they do. MT for mud and AT for everything. I chose ATs over MTs for the same reason that I chose ATs over Super Swampers. The benefit did not outweigh the terrain isolation(For my specific situation).

If I am that deep in the mud that my ATs can't get me out then I'm just too deep.(until the warranty runs out) laugh.gif

I know it's a long drive, but I have a swamp calling your ATs name! Oh, and I saw that little puddle you took pictures of, I hope you don't consider that mud! :-$
 

the1jferg

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My bad, I meant OME coils for 120 bucks a set.

Its not my money but I guess 2K worth of upgrades for 1/2 inch extra clearance is cost effective for some of you.

I guess thats why I was able to retire at 40 and do WTF I want everyday. O:)

Mutt, I ain't dogging ya man, all the stuff your running is good thought out choices, especially the claws. You probably even thought out the back spacing.
 

Mutt

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the1jferg said:
My bad, I meant OME coils for 120 bucks a set.

Its not my money but I guess 2K worth of upgrades for 1/2 inch extra clearance is cost effective for some of you.

I guess thats why I was able to retire at 40 and do WTF I want everyday. O:)

Please, tell me again how my 31"x10.50" wont stuff, rocket scientist? I don't care about dogging, I rather enjoy it.

............and the back spacing was thought out. I have almost no.....I repeat no rubbing in the front. I have minimal rubbing in the rear at full stuff. I spent some time with a straight edge, a square, and a measuring tape trying to see what would fit. I'd really wish I had a 4.0" backspace in the rear, but good luck finding it.
 

Brigrat

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Mutt said:
Brigrat said:
You are pretty much dead on, but there are factors that make a locker and mud tires not desireable or necessary for most people, and some who like to go off-road.

1. Most of us spend MOST of our time on the pavement, making and AT a much better choice most of the time

2. Not all offroading is done on mud. Where I live, dirt roads, and sandy beaches are the norm, making AT's a great choice

3. Lockers are fabulous, and I enjoyed having one on my last truck, but found that I NEVER once needed to use it (I had a selectable Auburn ECTED). It was never locked in other than the first time I went to the beach just to try it out.

4. For most users, a locker is never needed, unless you are a very serious off roader, you have no business even putting yourself in a position to need one.

"All Terrain" is very similar to "one size fits all". If you spend the majority of the time on the road and aren't serious about off roading it, why bother lifting it or installing larger tires? I'm sure the girls down at the Sonic aren't impressed with the soccor Mom Liberty anyhoo.

My Claws get great traction in the sand also, I routinely drive down the beach in two wheel drive fully inflated.

Why is it that most rock crawlers run a mud style tire?

Yeah, you'll never need a locker hopping curbs at the Wal-mart.

Easy on the soccer mom, and wal-mart crap...for the record, I grew up in the middle of nowhere, and we don't even have a wal-mart within a few hours...As for the soccer mom...she drives the Toyota Sequoia, and it is very cute, very black, and very pimped out soccer mom style. With our third girl due in about three weeks, it is the perfect soccer mom rig!

In my expereince driving in soft sand, since I have been doing so since I was ten years old, Mud tires are fine, but can and often do get to much traction and run a little deeper than I like. I have dug out dozens of lifted trucks with mud terrains, just as I have dug out idiots with AT's doing more than they are set up to do.

Don't judge me just because my two week old Liberty isn't lifted and rocking yet, the point of my post was to help you understand why some people don't do the same things to there rig that you do. If lifted with MT's was the only way to wheel, then we wouldn't need a forum to talk about all of the choices out there.

Like I said, before, most of the wheeling in my area is either soft sand, or dirt trails. I don't think I have ever had the opprotunity locally to "rock-crawl" or hit deep mud. An AT is the perfect balance for me, and for the region of the country I live in. If that makes me Mall Rated in your opinion then that is fine by me, I couldn't care less what anyones opinion of my choices of rig are...
 

fouros

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ok guys i think we are stating to get off topic here, we dont want this thread to degenerate into a ******* match


original post

I have an 05 sport kj and was recently off-roading when i got stuck...it was minor and i got out but it pissed me off enough to want to make a few upgrades. everything is stock right now(and it has done damn good so far). i would like to lift it up 2-2.5" and put some bigger tires on the stock rims(stock rims are actually grey renegade rims). what would you guys recommend? of the pics of jeeps on here i checked out i like bennet's setup so maybe something similar... what do you guys have? pos/neg's? i head something about lockers... what exactly are they and what do I need? also, i think skid plates would be good. this is a bunch of stuff and sounds kinda expensive. please give best advice on more inexpensive options without loosing all quality. what are the things i really need? thanks for putting up with my plethera of questions :)


lets see if we can help this bloke out with some decent answers to his questions


Peace out
 

Brigrat

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sorry for the venture off topic.

to the OP:

What you need is based on what you do. If mud is your poison, then get a frankenlift, big mud tires, and the Powertrax No-slip lunch-box locker.

The same set up would do great for rocks.

If you are planning on more time on the road, and periodic ventures off-road, then go with the lift, a high-quality limited slip like the factory trac-loc, or the Detroit True-Trac, and some versitle tires like the BFG AT's, or whatever fits your needs.
 

the1jferg

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MUTT,

"Please, tell me again how my 31"x10.50" wont stuff, rocket scientist"

I can't find where I said your tires would not stuff, all tires will stuff, some will bind when they stuff. I said your rig looks good and that you thought it out which you have verified. That kinda measuring and offset is exactly what it takes. The 10.50 is about right with the moab offset to prevent it from crashing into the area I have marked in that pic on my link.

I just noted that a 31" tire only gives you 3/4" more ground clearance than a 29.5" 245/70 at a fraction of the cost of getting and keeping the proper fitment of a 31" tire as you have done with absolutely no change in flex capability. Furthermore, if one did not do the proper homework as you have done they could loose capabilityand possibly bind up and break something.

So, to answer the fellas question, spend what you want, but I would put my money on a 2" coil lift, skids, and a locker first.

If you want big mud tires, you better consider the wheel (BS) offset as a key player in this scenerio
 

the1jferg

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http://www.thefergusons.us/kj/rub.jpg

Only proper Back spacing can prevent rubbing here or higher, right??

So a person could spend: http://www.boulderbars.com/frankenlift.htm

and $$$ for wheels to avoid it and gain 3/4" in ground clearance.

Or spend : http://rustysoffroad.com/Merchant2/...roduct_Code=OMECOILS&Category_Code=sus_kj_par

Keep the wheels they got and run around 245/70's and be 3/4" less ground clearance.

I said tires don't make that much of a diff, I ASSUMED original poster would never do what it took to run claws.
So, If you are willing to do what it takes to accommodate such a master as the claw then it does make a diff.

I would say that you built your rig around your tire choice, and its one of the few tires that (I believe) are worth building a rig around. You have a nice setup. I wish they made those in 16's small enough for the KJ, they don't and thats why you went with 15's.

What is your back spacing?
 

polomaan

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thanks guys!

hey thanks everybody for all the great comments.... i have noticed that a lot of you have your own 2 cents to put in...some a little more, haha... for basic info... i do ride on the road most of the time...i'm in college and can't avoid that... but i live close to mountains where there are some great OHV trails that are pretty tough i've heard...i would like to be able to do a few of those... i'm not into rock crawling because it seems too accident prone but i would like to make it to the top if the hill if ya know what i mean. i think i'll go with some AT's for sure and still debating on the lift... i am also looking into what voids the manufactures warranty. i know most of it does but how much of it? will they wack it to me if my ac goes out or some crap like that? is it worth having someone install my lift for me so i can get a warranty on that stuff? i have friends who could help. i am definately staying with the orig rims. they are the grey renegade ones and i really like them... changing them is to $$$. if i could as ya guys a favor...besides giving me sweet advice... could you post pics of your jeeps so i can get an idea of what i want? i know you want to show yours off, haha. i wouldn't mind copying somebody's setup either... screw being unique... i want a tested setup that kicks ass. i've been checking like every hour so keep the posts comin'!!! THANKS AGAIN...

i'm in fresno, ca so if anybody is near by let me know!

ps: you guys are also keeping me entertained with the one-upping while i'm at work... haha
 

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