Just got my first big maintenance done

[4Factor]

Just getting up on the 100,000 kms (about 99,300 or so) and I got all the BIG preventative maintenance issues done. MAN that's expensive. Did the rear fluids, T-case, ****** (and filter), front axle as well as all the time to inspect this and that. Even with my super nice guy mechanic (gives me super cheap rates, and a few weeks to pay) it still looks like I'll be over $500 (don't have an exact total yet) couple that with a major brake problem (master cylinder is failing at times) and I'm guessing it's going to be about $800 total.

I really didn't want to do the master cylinder (I looked at every other possible cause first) but twice in the past few weeks I almost ran into someone, the pedal went to the floor with no pressure. Since brakes are something you NEVER fool around with, I HAVE to get them fixed. There isn't anything as heart stopping as having no brakes (creates a sudden need for a change of pants!!) First time was at speed, lucky I had 20+ car lengths to figure out an alternate idea, parking brake gave my enough time for him to turn right and get out of my way. Then everything was fine, everything worked as it should. I took it to my mechanic next day and having just got new pads he replaced them again and returned the old ones as defective. Then the other day, I was stopped and lifted my foot for a sec, then re-applied the brake and bam, right to the floor again. I quickly pumped the brakes and managed to stop before hitting the guy ahead. Would've been just a rolling bump to the guy ahead of me, but damn that's annoying. So this time I said the thing isn't leaving his shop until something is done about it. I don't need an "oops" on my conscience even if I only hurt myself and no one else, it's just not worth it. Would you want to get in an accident with a guy and he says "well, I've been having problems with my brakes!"? Hopefully I can get this problem remedied with replacing the master cylinder.
And before you ask.. no I don't have ABS! (I know it's the first thing everyone thinks of)

 

[Dave]

Brake pedal should never go to the floor.........Wow. Glad you got it in the shop.

The only thing I can think of is a bad master cylinder. There is a diaphram in there and if some debri got in and the fluid is passing through, then you are losing pressure. Even a small leak you would notice. But if you had brake pads put on the new pads are thicker and you should have noticed the brakes were working better. Rotors should have been re-surfaced (turned). Unless a brake line was disconnected (not necessary to do this to change pads) then they need to be bled as you could have air in the lines. Checked the brake fluid first to make sure it is up.

Let us know how you make out.

Dave

 

[Marlon_JB2]

Ouch!!! That sounds very dangerous! Glad you're getting it fixed though, I'd *hate* to have to experience something like that.

 

[offrovering]

is your brake fluid good? assuming you have checked that and havent noticed a drop, or leak anywhere? if not, then cylinder is probably the issue, not a fun experience to go through, get it fixed

 

[JIMMY JEEP]

Using the car in front to assist your braking could work out kinda expensive.

 

[4Factor]

Using the car in front to assist your braking could work out kinda expensive.

HEH.. yeah WAY more expensive then replacing the master cylinder in the first place.

For all that asked, here's what I did.
Replaced the pads and rotors all around, rotors are Chrysler, pads were NAPA parts.
When brakes gave out the first time it was about 4 weeks after the replacement. I was home within 10 mins and I checked the fluid. It was fine (hairline under the full line) so I topped it up to a hairline over the full mark (barely anything added).
I phoned my mechanic told him exactly "brakes aren't working, I almost couldn't stop before hitting someone". Took it out there next day and the pads, rotors were inspected all around, one had a very tiny piece missing (flaked off) and they really looked brand new the fluid level was checked as well just in case it was leaking. He replaced the pads for free with Chrysler pads and all seemed fine, no problems. About 4 or 5 weeks later, the second incident (although much less dangerous) so I parked it out at the mechanics and said it ain't leaving until we know the problem. I sat and explained step by step what happened. As soon as I got to the part where I said "the pedal went right to the floor" he stopped me and asked why I didn't say that before. Up until now, he thought I meant they brakes weren't working effectively, not that they were failing altogether, the problem was immediately diagnosed as a master cylinder failure since it's the part that supplies the brake line pressure (and obviously isn't in this case) . A new master cylinder (new, not refurbished) was ordered and gets installed on Monday (Feb 25).
I considered every scenario but hadn't considered the master cylinder itself. Maybe the reservoir cap wasn't sealing properly and water was getting into the fluid (brake fluid is hygroscopic). Maybe the rotors had excess oil on them (the oil applied at the factory to keep them from rusting) or maybe road grime that caused them to fail. I also considered that being winter what are the chances I was actually on ice and didn't realize it? Sometimes it's the most obvious answer that ends up being correct!
Anyways we'll see after Monday what the answer is. Hopefully in 4 or 5 weeks I won't have another incident. Although ever since the first incident the brakes have felt REALLY weak. I think I'll know if this is the right solution cuz the brakes should feel all grabby again.

 

[tjkj2002]

There is a easy test that anyone can do themself to test the master cylinder and the vacumn booster.

You might want to check the vacumn booster as well.Just because the part is new doesn't mean it's good,seen it happen way to many times.Also did the brakes get bleed correctly? Replacing the master cylinder requires to bench bleed the master cylinder before it can be installed.If a bench bleed is not done the brakes can fail at anytime due to a major trapped air bubble in the system.

 

[offrovering]

I think fluid in the reservoir wouldnt always show air in the system. Because someone else put the pads on, I wouldnt rule out a bad bleed, resulting in air in the lines.

good luck though, that isnt fun!

 

[4Factor]

Ok, it's been almost a month since I got the new master cylinder and I haven't had any brake issues. Seems like the diagnosis was correct. I spent 17 bucks shy of a grand on my two vehicles in the past 2 weeks mostly on that major maintenance and the brake problem, including $100 on a new turn signal thingy in the steering column of my 97 neon (installed).

Although i bogged the Liberty through some heavy snow that was as deep as the top of the hood and the first "braking" wasn't much good while it cleared the snow then it was fine after that. I was expecting that so I knew to press the brakes right after getting through the snow to clear the pads.

It's been a fun winter, tons of snow and lots of stuck people. Dragged a Volvo wagon up a hill the other day cuz the lady got stuck at the bottom, a block from her house. 10" of new snow and still I yanked her free from the snowbank and up the hill (Dueler Revo's ARE the best!) The guy with the Rav4 and the Sierra pickup just stood back and watched. If I had of been wearing my Superman shirt I would've fit the part better.

 

[smarkham]

There is a cheaper alternative. Cut a hole through the car floor and break Fred Flinstone style. It'll save you a few hundred.

Or you can also buy a cheap anchor on Craigslist List and throw it out the window each time you want to come to a stop. Bit more dramatic than the first choice but equally effective.

Cheers


drive.gif

 

[BeepBeepJeepJeep]

Wait a minute... Your brake pedal went to the floor, and your mechanic thought it was the brake pads?

 

[JeepJeepster]

He didnt tell the mechanic that it was going to the floor.

Anytime the brake pedal goes to the floor, something is wrong. Doesnt matter is grease is on the rotors or youre on ice, it shouldnt go to the floor.

Care to tell us how to check the booster and the master cylinder tjkj?