03 Liberty Limited 3.7-Bad Mileage

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Hello,
I just recently purchased a 2003 Jeep Liberty 4WD with the 3.7, Stock, and auto trans. I have been averaging 10 ish mpg driving around town. Its been on one road trip since it was purchased. That was about a 150mi trip the day it was purchased and brought home. Since then it has seen mostly city driving.

The 150mi trip average according to the VIC was about 23 or so. Not bad. But, shortly after buying it it started blowing the BCM fuse. That problem was resolved, but also reset the MPG average in the VIC.

When I got it it had been throwing 5 (yes 5) DTCs:

P0133 (Bank 1/1 O2 slow Response --- Cleared DTC, Has NOT Returned, or been flagged as "Pending"

P0158 (Bank 2/2 O2 High Voltage) --- Replaced
P0455 (EVAP Large Leak)
P0442 (EVAP Small Leak) -- Cleaned gas cap seal, DTC Went Away... For now.
P0837 (4wd Switch Circuit Range/Performance)--- 4WD operates correctly, this hasn't popped up after DTC clear either.

Other things that are happening:

- Oil Leak (Most likely cause is Valve Covers (specifically the passenger side), according to info on this site.)

-3 ABS DTCs:
-Left wheel sensor
-Right Wheel Sensor
-Pump Low voltage

I am not as concerned about the ABS codes as I am about the mileage, because it *****. I know its a gas guzzler, but 10MPG in a stock 3.7 is ridiculous.

I bought an Actron CP9850A last night, and damn, does that thing have a lot available! It DID report (via mode 1 or 6?? I believe??) "Test 01 $11 LOW". That should be O2 bank 1/1, right? And even though it hasn't lit the MIL it could still be bad??

The wave form graph for 1/1 looked ok.. but that doesnt mean anything either, right? Also, I noticed that my "Absolute throttle position" even with the engine OFF is "12.6".. Is that normal??

Fuel Trim for 1/1 I have also seen as high as 6% positive.

Anyway, like I said... I have a LOT wrong. With that scan tool I can give you guys anything you need. Just let me know what you want to see.

Thanks again!
 

renegade 04

Full Access Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2014
Messages
1,466
Reaction score
18
Location
Albany New York
You will want to have a relearn done to the cam shaft position sensor. I did this and my mpg went up a good 2 -3 mpg. The better thing would be to have a relearn done on the PCM. How many mile on it?
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Hi renegade. Not really positive. Only had her about a week or so. I think its about 155 or 156K. Is that relearn something that can be done at home? I remember seeing somewhere a procedure like disconnecting the positive and shorting the positive to ground to clear PCM memory, and to force it to load the factory settings, and NOT what it has "learned".

Have you heard of that?
 

tlrtucker

Full Access Member
Joined
Jun 4, 2013
Messages
250
Reaction score
1
Location
Denver
Ouch, definitely low mpg's there. I'm lifted and getting ~16 mpg's.

Bad O2 sensors can definitely affect mpg's, but I wouldn't expect it that much. Check less obvious things like your air filter, tire pressure, alignment and check for bad wheel bearings. All of those can cut down your mpg's. Switching to synthetic's can also free up a couple mpg's.

For the evap leaks, check your hoses going in and out of your canister back by the fuel tank. It's really common for those to split and throw a code. They are a super cheap and easy fix, once you find the culprit. I doubt that's a reason for your horrible mpg's tho...
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Thanks guys. I'll have to try that procedure tonight. I have also heard that the upstream o2 sensor can cause all kinds of hell if its bad, especially if its the 1/1 sensor. My problem is that it seems like a difficult one to remove. I did 2/2 by myself, but that one was easy, other than getting the O2 sensor to break loose.

The 1/1 sensor is crammed up next to the frame and exhaust and everything. I cant even see the connector. I just reach over top the frame/A-Arm/ whatever, and can feel the connector. I can also see it from the top of the engine bay. Is there a secret to getting this one out?

I thought about taking the FL tire off and the splash guard in the wheel well to see if i could get at the connector easier. Is that even worth the time?
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Here is some moving data. This was from a total of 60 frames of data.

FRAME: 56 TM: 158.1

MIL STATUS($10) Off
MIL STATUS($18) Off
ABSLT TPS($10) 12.6
ABSLT TPS($18) 12.9
ENG SPEED($10) 1007
ENG SPEED($18) 999
CALC LOAD(%) 4.3
MAP("HG) 8.3
COOLANT(°F) 194
IAT(°F) 91
IGN ADV(°) 13.5
ST FTRM1(%) -0.8
ST FTRM2(%) -1.6
LT FTRM1(%) 2.3
LT FTRM2(%) 0.8
VEH SPEED(MPH) 34
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S11(V) 0.900
ST FTRM11(%) -1.6
O2S12(V) 0.080
O2S21(V) 0.900
ST FTRM21(%) -3.1
O2S22(V) 0.720
OBD2 STAT CA

---------------------

FRAME: 57 TM: 160.8

MIL STATUS Off
MIL STATUS Off
ABSLT TPS(%) 12.6
ABSLT TPS(%) 12.9
ENG SPEED(RPM) 844
ENG SPEED(RPM) 845
CALC LOAD(%) 4.3
MAP("HG) 9.4
COOLANT(°F) 194
IAT(°F) 93
IGN ADV(°) 10.0
ST FTRM1(%) -3.1
ST FTRM2(%) -6.3
LT FTRM1(%) 2.3
LT FTRM2(%) -0.8
VEH SPEED(MPH) 22
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S11(V) 0.880
ST FTRM11(%) -3.9
O2S12(V) 0.440
O2S21(V) 0.060
ST FTRM21(%) -4.7
O2S22(V) 0.360
OBD2 STAT CA

---------------------

FRAME: 58 TM: 163.6

MIL STATUS($10) Off
MIL STATUS($18) Off
ABSLT TPS($10) 12.6
ABSLT TPS($18) 12.9
ENG SPEED($10) 689
ENG SPEED($18) 689
CALC LOAD(%) 3.9
MAP("HG) 11.2
COOLANT(°F) 194
IAT(°F) 95
IGN ADV(°) 10.0
ST FTRM1(%) -6.3
ST FTRM2(%) -10.2
LT FTRM1(%) 0.0
LT FTRM2(%) -3.1
VEH SPEED(MPH) 6
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S11(V) 0.760
ST FTRM11(%) -7.0
O2S12(V) 0.220
O2S21(V) 0.060
ST FTRM21(%) -4.7
O2S22(V) 0.060
OBD2 STAT CA

---------------------


I will post idling values shortly.
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
these were taken idling in the driveway, with the heater on setting 2, full heat, using the head and feet setting:

---------------------

FRAME: 56 TM: 157.4

MIL STATUS($10) Off
MIL STATUS($18) Off
ABSLT TPS($10) 12.6
ABSLT TPS($18) 12.6
ENG SPEED($10) 602
ENG SPEED($18) 601
CALC LOAD(%) 3.1
MAP("HG) 9.4
COOLANT(°F) 196
IAT(°F) 142
IGN ADV(°) 10.0
ST FTRM1(%) -2.3
ST FTRM2(%) -0.8
LT FTRM1(%) 10.2
LT FTRM2(%) 8.6
VEH SPEED(MPH) 0
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S11(V) 0.100
ST FTRM11(%) 0.8
O2S12(V) 0.100
O2S21(V) 0.160
ST FTRM21(%) 0.8
O2S22(V) 0.240
OBD2 STAT CA

---------------------

FRAME: 57 TM: 160.0

MIL STATUS Off
MIL STATUS Off
ABSLT TPS(%) 12.6
ABSLT TPS(%) 12.9
ENG SPEED(RPM) 603
ENG SPEED(RPM) 609
CALC LOAD(%) 2.7
MAP("HG) 9.2
COOLANT(°F) 196
IAT(°F) 142
IGN ADV(°) 8.5
ST FTRM1(%) -1.6
ST FTRM2(%) 0.8
LT FTRM1(%) 10.2
LT FTRM2(%) 8.6
VEH SPEED(MPH) 0
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S11(V) 0.760
ST FTRM11(%) -1.6
O2S12(V) 0.100
O2S21(V) 0.700
ST FTRM21(%) -1.6
O2S22(V) 0.780
OBD2 STAT CA

---------------------

FRAME: 58 TM: 162.7

MIL STATUS($10) Off
MIL STATUS($18) Off
ABSLT TPS($10) 12.6
ABSLT TPS($18) 12.9
ENG SPEED($10) 605
ENG SPEED($18) 596
CALC LOAD(%) 2.7
MAP("HG) 9.4
COOLANT(°F) 196
IAT(°F) 142
IGN ADV(°) 9.0
ST FTRM1(%) -0.8
ST FTRM2(%) 0.0
LT FTRM1(%) 10.2
LT FTRM2(%) 8.6
VEH SPEED(MPH) 0
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S11(V) 0.720
ST FTRM11(%) -2.3
O2S12(V) 0.100
O2S21(V) 0.180
ST FTRM21(%) 0.0
O2S22(V) 0.400
OBD2 STAT CA

---------------------
 

tommudd

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
22,456
Reaction score
3,642
Location
Southeastern Ohio
Thanks guys. I'll have to try that procedure tonight. I have also heard that the upstream o2 sensor can cause all kinds of hell if its bad, especially if its the 1/1 sensor. My problem is that it seems like a difficult one to remove. I did 2/2 by myself, but that one was easy, other than getting the O2 sensor to break loose.

The 1/1 sensor is crammed up next to the frame and exhaust and everything. I cant even see the connector. I just reach over top the frame/A-Arm/ whatever, and can feel the connector. I can also see it from the top of the engine bay. Is there a secret to getting this one out?

I thought about taking the FL tire off and the splash guard in the wheel well to see if i could get at the connector easier. Is that even worth the time?

Won't help to remove tire and splash guard, won't gain a thing. I've switched mine ( 1/1) out without too much problem , took maybe 15 minutes at most . Sort of hard to reach the connector but not that bad
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Is yours 4wd?? Mine is. And all the videos i see are for 2wd. Non of the extra 4wd in the way.
 

tjkj2002

Full Access Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Messages
10,612
Reaction score
39
Location
Somewhere between being sane and insane!
Won't help to remove tire and splash guard, won't gain a thing. I've switched mine ( 1/1) out without too much problem , took maybe 15 minutes at most . Sort of hard to reach the connector but not that bad
Being he has a '03 it could have the '02 style exhaust which is vastly different then later '03+ KJ's.


For the OP you either got bad O2's(bank 1,drivers side),bad cats(going bad),or you got a vacuum leak(could be EVAP issues causing this).
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Tommud: I was almost positive you had 4wd, why else would you be here, right??

It also had previously thrown the p0455 large leak code. I replaced a short elbow line on the canister, and the code hasn't reset yet. I can apparently command the EVAP test to run with my scanner, but it hasn't completed thus far.

Yes, I believe I have the '02 style exhaust. The build date on my vehicle is 01/03. It has 4 02 sensors. The front two on either side are nearly impossible to get to. and you cant even visually see the connectors. I had a guy offer me $100 to do the job, which i believe included the price of the o2 sensor.

I know $100 for what everyone says is " a 15 minute job" would seem ridiculous to some, but for ME to do it myself, and have enough room to work comfortably, I think i would have to remove the driveshaft. Its so cramped at bank 1/1, I cant even position a can of PB blaster so I can spray the nut of the sensor.
 

tommudd

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
22,456
Reaction score
3,642
Location
Southeastern Ohio
Tommud: I was almost positive you had 4wd, why else would you be here, right??

It also had previously thrown the p0455 large leak code. I replaced a short elbow line on the canister, and the code hasn't reset yet. I can apparently command the EVAP test to run with my scanner, but it hasn't completed thus far.

Yes, I believe I have the '02 style exhaust. The build date on my vehicle is 01/03. It has 4 02 sensors. The front two on either side are nearly impossible to get to. and you cant even visually see the connectors. I had a guy offer me $100 to do the job, which i believe included the price of the o2 sensor.

I know $100 for what everyone says is " a 15 minute job" would seem ridiculous to some, but for ME to do it myself, and have enough room to work comfortably, I think i would have to remove the driveshaft. Its so cramped at bank 1/1, I cant even position a can of PB blaster so I can spray the nut of the sensor.

The 02s are a lot tighter for sure, didn't see what year you had :shrug:
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
I just called the mechanic. He said hes going to diagnose for about $65 to make sure its definitely an o2. And then about $100 to replace the 1/1 sensor. I told him to go ahead and replace 2/1 as well (if 1/1 went, 2/1 probably isnt far behind, right??) So looks like about $265-300 or so... fair price for convenience and not having to pay if I #$%# something up myself??
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
The mechanic replaced 1/1, and 2/1. Seems to be getting better mileage. I also changed the PCV valve, and fixed the leaky passenger side valve cover gasket, and put a new air filter in it. got about 15.6 or so on the highway and about 13.5 in the city. I still would like to change out the spark plugs, but other than that shes running pretty good.

Now I have to just get used to the throttle. I came from a 99 chevy tracker 4 ******, with about what ?? 89 hp? and 110 lbs of torque to this v6 Liberty with 210 hp and 235 lbs of torque. Entirely different monster. I roast tire occasionally because i am so used to having to almost use pedal power on that tracker. not on this damn Jeep though!!

Anyway , thanks for everyones input!
 

Surfo

Full Access Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Messages
32
Reaction score
0
Location
Puerto Vallarta, Mexico
I have the same problem but som of the answers were a little bit to technical for me...

Hello! I know jeep Liberty is not very efficient engine but his is ridiculous!

I would like to know if anyone has any idea of the increase in fuel consumption.

I have a 2006 Liberty 4x4 when I was bought it gave me around 18 mpg with 30,000 miles on it, NOW with 80,000 i just get around 9 or 10 mpg

Ive haven´t done any major service, since it runs great with lot´s of power !

What will be the list of things to replace?

Thanks
 

ajack

New Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
0
Location
Erie
Its back to doing the same thing again. Mileage is about 8MPG or so. Horrific mileage. Its got New plugs, New Air filter, new PCV valve, passed a bottle of Techron through it on the last tank of gas. Not really sure what else i can try, or that I am missing.

I think partially one of the biggest problems is that I dont have enough time to get the engine up to a respectable operating temp. My commute is 2 miles. Everyday, each way. I can live with 13, or maybe even a low 12, but this 8MPG nonsense is ridiculous.

I havent been brave enough to use 4wd either... Because then I think I'd be calculating gallons per mile. The ONLY other thing i can think of is something is screwy with my ABS. The car is throwing 3 codes. ABS low vlotage (or pressure.. I forget), Front left wheel sensor fault, Front right wheel sensor fault.

Can something like that lead to screwy mileage? And no... I dont believe a brake is sticking, but i can confirm that ABS is NOT working.
 

Latest posts

Members online

Top