45rfe Hard Shifting

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02Geep

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Just bought a very clean '02 Limited 4x4 w/selec track last month. I'm new to these forums, and actually I've never even posted in any car forum before. I only google search and just read posts to figure out my car problems. I come from Miata ownership so this is a new world for me.

I'm posting because I haven't found any concrete solutions to my 45rfe transmission issue after a couple days of searching. I have no service records for it. If I don't get any suggestions from y'all, I'll post the outcome of this issue here.

Here are the symptoms:

-cruising around town and on highway w/ light-to-medium throttle does not cause any issue at any speed.

-While in overdrive on highway (~65mph) pinning throttle does not immediately downshift, but then will suddenly jerk and downshift very roughly. It startles my wife who says it feels like she's getting rear-ended every time it happens... a bit of a stretch, but it's a pretty harsh shift nevertheless.

-while cruising at 30-40 mph, pinning throttle causes normal kick down, but when upshifting again, it will jerk very harshly if you let up off the gas.

I'm planning on taking it into a trans specialist to diagnose it, but I thought I'd throw this up here to get some feedback. I'll let y'all know what the shop says.
 

yellocoyote

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I would start by servicing it - new fluid/filters. It'll likely take 2 filters - one flat, pancake style, and one that's cylinder shaped. It's a good idea to go through all your fluids if you haven't done so yet... to rule out the easiest issues first.

Otherwise, I had a similar problem with mine that ended up being as simple as dropping the pan and replacing the shift kit. That's another more simple, less expensive idea... but do the fluids/filter first.
 

WINGDOG

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My last KJ would shift violently back into overdrive if you floored it to pass someone. If I let off the throttle slightly before the upshift it was fine. Lived with it that way for ten years without any issues. And yes the fluid and filters were changed regularly.
 

jeeptorino68

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when passing (after it downshifts) and then when the revs get up high enough that it finally upshifts, mine is a pretty hard upshift too. but only if you are really getting to the redline.
i agree. fluid and filter change. would be best. even low or overfilled on fluid could cause issues.
 

Adam Roby

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Wasn't there talk at some point about having the transmission reset/relearned/reprogrammed by the dealer to deal with harsh shifting?

I've been meaning to have mine done just to see. Mine bangs from a stop when accelerating when its cold. When hot I can mash the pedal and it'll spin the tires but won't knock at all.. been driving me crazy as well. Mine is more like a delayed downshift into low... I dunno.
 

02Geep

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I have heard about the relearning procedure, although I'm not sure if it needs to be done by a dealer. I hope not. I just checked the fluid last night. It's nice and red and doesn't smell burnt from what I can tell. I didn't notice any deposits in it. I'm taking it over to the shop today to see what they think.

On Jeep forums this is a very common problem on the WJ with the same transmission. But I never read anywhere that they had to actually replace the unit. It was usually a solenoid or sensor.

I'll update after I take it to the shop.
 

turblediesel

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The CRDs have the 45rfe transmission and a lot of the dipsticks are too long so they give false readings and pop-up from the dipstick/filler tube. Some get better results by adding an extra quart of atf4.

FSM has some kind of "relearn" procedures that don't require a dealer.
 

02Geep

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Thanks for the replies! I'll have to check out a relearn procedure after possibly adding some more ATF+4. Got the Jeep back today and the shop said everything was fine. They said "it's shifting exactly as the computer says it should". No codes or anything. Seems to me that these hard shifts would but excessive wear on the transmission over time. But I guess this thing is 15 years old and has 150k miles so maybe not...
 

uss2defiant

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not related to your situation but in cause you are going to change the filters yourself. there was a TSB on the spin on return filter but from what I recently read and if i'm not mistaken, the old filter design causes sluggish/delayed shift when not up to temp or when parked over night so make sure to get a mopar filter.

Did the shop not check the level for you?
follow the instructions on the owners manual to check the fluid level.
 
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02Geep

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I checked in myself before I took it in to them, and it looked fine to me, as far as the color and they didn't say anything about it. I'll have to double check on the level though when I get home.

Since I don't know when it was done, I should probably change the fluid in the diffs and transfer case while I'm at it.
 

Adam Roby

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I did all the same steps you are doing when I first got mine. Brought it to a specialized transmission place, had fluid flushed and filters changed, they checked inside and out and everything was "perfect" but I still to this day have the hard shifts at times. I brought it to my mechanic which now does mostly lifts for Jeeps (he used to work for the dealer) and he was supposed to do the relearn sequence for me but he shares the tool with another garage and did not have it on hand the last time I went. A little frustrating but I will eventually get it done for sure... maybe I'll have him do my oil change just to get it in there as an excuse to do the relearn.
 

02Geep

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Another shop tells me a shift collar is probably going out. I honestly don't know what that means in an automatic-I know nothing about them. Has anyone had experiences with the input or output speed sensor on the transmission going out? I suspect it may be failing since the harsh shift is not consistent. But I have zero codes. A few weeks ago I had a failing speed sensor on the diff (code P0500), but no light came on for several miles. I just replaced it while doing my differential. Anyway, so is it possible to have failing (not completely failed) input/output sensors, but for the computer to not pick up on it?
 

HoosierJeeper

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What kind of computer do you mean? A DRBIII like what a dealer or trans shop would have should pick up on anything.
 

02Geep

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Following up with this again... it's been a few months and after avoiding driving habits that cause the bad shifts, it's gotten more prevalent. Now it does it every upshift after kick-down in any gear. Also, I've isolated a knocking sound coming from somewhere near the bell housing. This just started last week. I thought it was my engine until going over everything with a stethoscope. Possible cracked flex plate? Anyway back to the shifting-What I've done so far is this:

-Transmission flush and filter replacement.
-Both speed sensors replaced.

Dealer says nothing comes up and that they would have to disassemble it to investigate it further. They said it would be at least 400 just for labor to diagnose.

I'm so tempted to just buy a used trans for almost the same price.

In case the dealer is jerkin me, I decided to get a second opinion. It's in the shop now and I'll post back with results.
 

02Geep

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I really want to get this thing healthy before I do a lift and tires. My front skid plate scoops up way too much mud!
 

HerronScott

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Just bought a very clean '02 Limited 4x4 w/selec track last month. I'm new to these forums, and actually I've never even posted in any car forum before. I only google search and just read posts to figure out my car problems. I come from Miata ownership so this is a new world for me.

I'm posting because I haven't found any concrete solutions to my 45rfe transmission issue after a couple days of searching. I have no service records for it. If I don't get any suggestions from y'all, I'll post the outcome of this issue here.

Here are the symptoms:

-cruising around town and on highway w/ light-to-medium throttle does not cause any issue at any speed.

-While in overdrive on highway (~65mph) pinning throttle does not immediately downshift, but then will suddenly jerk and downshift very roughly. It startles my wife who says it feels like she's getting rear-ended every time it happens... a bit of a stretch, but it's a pretty harsh shift nevertheless.

-while cruising at 30-40 mph, pinning throttle causes normal kick down, but when upshifting again, it will jerk very harshly if you let up off the gas.

I'm planning on taking it into a trans specialist to diagnose it, but I thought I'd throw this up here to get some feedback. I'll let y'all know what the shop says.

Not exactly the same but our 2002 also started to exhibit some stutter downshifting occasionally as well after the dealer did a transmission flush instead of just a normal transmission drain and filter change service that I had requested (they ended up not charging me the extra cost at the time). Usually I think it's either a shift from 3rd to 4th or possibly 2nd to 3rd when you are accelerating a little faster than "normal".

Unfortunately it's infrequent enough that I can't make it happen when I take it in to them.

So I'll be interested to hear if you find a cause for your issue.

Scott
 

02Geep

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A follow up on this:

It’s been several months and I pretty much gave up on this issue until today. I wasn’t getting a diagnosis from any shop including dealer. They all said everything is fine and that the hard shift may be due to something internal that they’d have to inspect by a tear down. So it still has the harsh shift from 2-3, and a slight jolt from 3-4. It ONLY does it after the transmission has downshifted to speed up.

Anyway I decided to just live with it and not worry about it until today. Today I changed lanes to pass a semi truck and while it was upshifting after the “kickdown” gear change, it didn’t really change gears like normal. Instead it slipped into 3rd gradually as if the car was equipped with a CVT. It now does this every time it upshifts if you keep the throttle depressed. The weirdest part is that there is now a jolt every time I press and let off the gas even slightly. This issue just started today.

I have a check engine light on right now, but that is due to a bad cat, which I am planning on replacing this week. I’m not sure if other codes are on there. I will continue to update this thread even if it takes several months to get this right. I may just save and get a rebuilt trans. Who knows...
 

flair1111

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I would start by servicing it - new fluid/filters. It'll likely take 2 filters - one flat, pancake style, and one that's cylinder shaped. It's a good idea to go through all your fluids if you haven't done so yet... to rule out the easiest issues first.

Otherwise, I had a similar problem with mine that ended up being as simple as dropping the pan and replacing the shift kit. That's another more simple, less expensive idea... but do the fluids/filter first.

replacing the shift kit? mine does this to. what do i need to buy? ive done 3 fluid and filter changes and it still changes from 3rd to 4th very hard.
 

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